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Too much cross-tier trading

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Mullebutz, May 12, 2019.

  1. Mullebutz

    Mullebutz Seeker

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2018
    40 pages of trades and most of them are cross-tier trades, offering tier 3 for tier 1 or 2. I don't mind picking up a cross-tier trade from a fellow to help them out or even from a neighbor every now and then to build a good relationship, but this is getting to be a bit much. In my understanding cross-tier should be kept to a minimum not be used as an easy way to boost your own city out of the pockets of others.
    Perhaps the developers could add a refined search filter for those of us who are tired of clicking through endless offers of 500 gems for 1990 scrolls or 7990 planks and who just want to do fair trades. End of rant, stepping off the soapbox ;)

    Happy gaming, Mulle
     
    Hekata, EdwardTrunk, andreoti and 6 others like this.
  2. m4rt1n

    m4rt1n Summoner

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2017
    I agree, and since the latest sets were introduced, it appears everyone now has an abundance of T3 goods and fills the trader with ridiculous trades wanting huge amounts of T1 goods. The fact that the trader puts these at 2* and 3*, doesn't help the matter.
    16:1 for T1 trades is far to much and if I need to place any use 6:1 instead.
     
    CiraKelley, Mullebutz and LazyTony like this.
  3. Timneh

    Timneh Necromancer

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2016
    I just looked at the trader after reading this and out of 43 pages of trades it worked out to being 30 pages that were cross tier or zero star. I really think the devs need to look at this and try to sort something out. Banning cross tier trades would be my preference but i know that is never going to happen.
     
    CiraKelley and Mullebutz like this.
  4. FieryArien

    FieryArien Conjurer

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2018
    You must be in my neighborhood, Mullebutz. :rolleyes: Definitely +1 on the topic of cross trades search filter.

    I literally became allergic to cross tier trades and don’t take them on principle. I mean even those occasional ones asking for higher tier than offering. (Yes, there are cases when I take cross trades in my fellowship when a player asks for help in the chat. However, I never do that from my own initiative, because I doubt that these loads of cross trades are placed there out of desperation.)
     
    CiraKelley and Mullebutz like this.
  5. LadyHavva

    LadyHavva Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2018
    It's like that in all neighbourhoods these days. I was trying to help new neighbours by taking regular trades, but more and more of them are posting several cross tier trades next to their regular ones. So nowadays I use the FS filter.
     
    CiraKelley and Mullebutz like this.
  6. LazyTony

    LazyTony Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2018
    Please please please could someone pass on this ten thousandth thread on trades filters, cross tier to someone with the power to fix it? If I have to read another one I might find myself emptying the medicine cabinet into my stomach. It is by far the biggest complaint/request from players.
     
  7. Pauly7

    Pauly7 Illusionist

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    A new thread on this topic starts once every few weeks and I will say the same as I always say - There is nothing wrong with cross-tier trading. The problem is with Inno's refusal to budge on their view of T3 being worth 4 times tier 2 and 16 times tier 1. That is what is absurd.

    In my opinion they should get rid of the whole assumed ratio business and have the game assign 2 stars to any trade which is 1:1, even if it is 100 gems for 100 marble. Then we can forget the whole idea that "tiers" even exist and people will just trade sensibly at levels that make sense.

    In my opinion tier 3 is worth a MAXIMUM of 3 times tier 1 and dependent on your playing style and city set up often much closer to 1:1.
     
  8. SoggyShorts

    SoggyShorts Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    trader improved.png

    There was already a problem that was made a bit worse by the very powerful winter set, but not everyone chose to go for it.
    The recent increase in cross tier BS has a lot to do with the Jester's Tavern. Players generally had a decent balance before, but now virtually everyone gained the production of 3 extra T3 buildings. That's a 100% increase for many players.
     
  9. SoggyShorts

    SoggyShorts Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    I calculated it out for one of my cities and I'm making just under 200,000 T3 per day from my sets.
    If Inno still thinks 16:1 is fair, how can I make 3,200,000 T1 per day to be balanced? That requires 143 planks factories at max level.o_O
     
  10. Mullebutz

    Mullebutz Seeker

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2018
    I am fairly new to the forum although I've been playing for almost a year, so I was unaware that this question has been posted many times before. Before posting I did check if there wasn't already a post dealing with this subject but perhaps I did not go back far enough. In any case, I am glad to hear I am not the only one that this is bugging and maybe it needs to be said as many times as it takes for someone to find a sensible solution to this trading mess. I am not fundamentally against cross-tier or inequal trading as it can be to the advantage of the fellowship to help smaller players advance faster. But there should be some limit to it.
     
    UlyssesBlue likes this.
  11. LazyTony

    LazyTony Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2018
    Mullebutz, please don't take my comment as a personal criticism, it wasn't meant as such. We see a few new threads created every week in this area, and every comment I have seen from every player expresses a desire for change.
     
  12. UlyssesBlue

    UlyssesBlue Conjurer

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2017
    I really like the partial trade feature SoggyShorts suggests. It would result in a lot less clogging of the trader, and reduce the amount of endless clicking required to trade a large volume of goods. I can see it being especially useful for small cities who are currently unable to make use of the large trades posted by larger cities, and therefore struggle to get goods in a timely fashion.

    A minor tweak: Perhaps instead of the purchase buttons being scaled according to the size of the trade it could be scaled according to what they buyer can afford, e.g. you had the choice of spending 10%, 25% or maximum possible amount of your stockpile, regardless of the size of the trade. So for example, let's say you had 100,000 marble in stock, the trader might look a bit like this:
    Offer____________Demand_______Rating______Trader
    120,000 planks____120,000 marble__**__________[10k] [25k] [100k]
    70,000 planks_____70,000 marble___**__________[10k] [25k] [70k]
    125 planks________125 marble_____**__________[125]
    If you were really short of goods and only had 5,000 marble in stock, those same trades would instead look like this:
    Offer____________Demand_______Rating______Trader
    120,000 planks____120,000 marble__**__________[500] [1,250] [5,000]
    70,000 planks_____70,000 marble___**__________[500] [1,250] [5,000]
    125 planks________125 marble_____**__________[125]
     
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  13. SoggyShorts

    SoggyShorts Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    There is the potential for confusion with 1 and 3-star trades as players might mix up whether it is 5,000 that they are buying or paying, and even if they know it's 5,000 from their stash, an odd ratio would be hard to math out in your head.

    Also, with that tweak, it would be very important to separate trade notifications from all other notifications. Imagine being nickel and dimed 500 at a time on your 120,000 trade.

    Speaking of notifications, overhauling those was the very first approved beta suggestion I saw that never happened. Nov 3 2016 https://beta.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/communication-notification-screen-overhaul.6497/
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2019
    m4rt1n and Mullebutz like this.
  14. Vetrinus

    Vetrinus Alchemist

    Joined:
    May 21, 2016
    A filter would be nice indeed. That being said, I've found myself on both the "accepting" and "offering" part of cross-tier trades a number of times, so I know for a fact that there can be instances in which such a trade is beneficial to both parts - even though admittedly I tend to dislike having to put up cross-tiers and whenever I do, I make sure there's some actual margin of 3-star-ness (as opposed to those who just go down by say, 1 unit in order to have the trade list as 3 star), and I do tell fellows NOT to accept those UNLESS it actually benefits them, because yes, I feel that most often than not, cross-tier trades work to the advantage of the one who puts them up. But not always, as I said I've found myself gladly accepting some (2 stars even). But to call for a ban would be rather absurd - nobody forces anyone to accept a trade, after all.
    As to the current inflation with T3... apparently things are very different for some people. I had to build a new T3 manufactory despite having the Winter Set and the Jester's Tavern. What I always have an abundance of is T2 instead.
    Soggy's suggestions are very nice, hopefully someone will forward them to the dev team.
     
    Mullebutz likes this.
  15. UlyssesBlue

    UlyssesBlue Conjurer

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2017
    Fair point. Separating out the trade notifications would be essential. They're annoying enough as it is.

    Also a good point. Perhaps the solution is to explicitly list the unit cost in the trade. This could replace the 'Demand' column, since we're now effectively listing this in the buttons in the 'Trader' column. Perhaps the trader could look something like this:

    Offer________Price_____________Rating___Seller______Purchase
    Planks_______1 marble each______2*_______Player1_____[10k] [25k] [100k]
    Planks_______0.8 marble each____3*_______Player2______[10k] [25k] [70k]
    Planks_______1.2 marble each____1*_______Player3______[125]
    Planks_______4 marble each______0*_______Player4______[10k] [25k] [50k]
     
  16. SoggyShorts

    SoggyShorts Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    oooo I like that!
     
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  17. UlyssesBlue

    UlyssesBlue Conjurer

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2017
    How about something like this? A slight change to my above suggestion in that instead of having multiple buttons under the 'purchase' column you just have the one, but you can specify the size of the purchase using a setting up the top of the trader.
    [​IMG]

    I posted this as a suggestion here, where it goes into a little more detail.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2019
  18. Wowwie

    Wowwie Spellcaster

    Joined:
    May 18, 2017
    You are always getting players that will do as they please :
    the Trade gives a wide variety of options, \ taking those options away ruins the integrity of the trader,
    I prefer the trader as is ,someone some where must be taking the trades or else the players would not be placing them,
    Each Fellowship has their own way of trading great option,
    Single players have their own way of Trading: great option:
    You may not like the Trades dont take them:
    Use the filter for your trades your looking for
    I have said the Trader is only as good as the Players make it.:)
     
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  19. SoggyShorts

    SoggyShorts Sorcerer

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    This argument is narrow. It fails to account for overall annoyance. Because of the terrible sorting where cross trades are in the middle of fair ones I don't clear the trader at all rather than risk a misclick.
     
    Mullebutz and Timneh like this.
  20. Mullebutz

    Mullebutz Seeker

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2018
    If there was a filter to eliminate the cross-tier trades I'd use it. Especially on the phone, a misclick happens quickly and at a high cost. No thanks :)
     

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