DeletedUser
Guest
wow, you've managed to find a post of mine from February.... were you a bit bored?
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Discussion News from Beta (may contain spoilers!)
- Thread starter Muf-Muf
- Start date
LazyTony
Sorcerer
Lisica, the obvious reason they couldn't allow general purpose KP instants is that they could be saved up for a new chapter opening, making KP requirements of techs meaningless. I understand the annoyance at choice being removed, but you NEED lots of wonder levels to get through halflings and elementals, this is a nudge in a direction that will help any player that plans on playing for a long time, and the compensation is an increased amount of KP. Its a moot point anyway, it will not change now.
LazyTony
Sorcerer
Mickey, I think you are missing the general point of fori's post which I couldn't agree with more. The balance between early and late chapter players is well out of whack. A chapter 4-6 account can score 5-6k points every tourney, week in, week out, with no pain. This simply isn't possible if you are at the end of the tech tree.
DeletedUser5976
Guest
Hmm, I am almost at the end of chapter 4 and unlock each tourney as many provinces as I have scouted and unlocked and for my boosted goods I fight 5 rounds in a tourney yet I cannot make 5-6K points. This tournament I made 1,6K on 8 provinces for 5 rounds. If I manage to do the 6th round I make 2K the most. The only way of making that amount of points for me would be to overscout severely, but even then I would need to deplete all my goods and some more to unlock the scouted provinces. In fact in the top 10 of Arendyll this week there is no one in chapter 4-6. The lowest I could see was a chapter 7 player.
DeletedUser
Guest
lols, I'm still scouting on the cities which have finished Elementals and I don't clear, by the time the next guest race comes along I'll have plenty of kp to get from the world map!
and while its a moot point and won't change now, I'm still entitled to my opinion... or should I keep quiet and have to see people banging on about what a great and wonderful thing it is for them personally?
DeletedUser
Guest
That's one server out of 3, what about checking Fel as well?
DeletedUser
Guest
Thank you for your permission...Sure, you can howl at the moon for as long as you like
however as said before, I'm as entitled to my opinion as you are to yours, the minority likes it the majority doesn't however Inno will continue with its game changes which people don't necessary like, and those who do will shout louder and louder about how great it is for them personally.
LazyTony
Sorcerer
Missing the point. The fact it is possible to do this at a lower chapter with no martial wonders to help proves that the balance is broken.
I'm not at all convinced you have it the right way round. My FS has players has 14 players at S + D and earlier, and its unanimously welcomed by 25/25.
On a final note, do you have to be so aggressive? I said it was a moot point, you agreed then put words in my mouth about not being entitled to your opinion, which I have never said.
Killiak
Artisan
So what is the difference with people getting a KP injection every week from the tourney? And even IF they saved up, that means that they didn't use the KP they earned before at that time. Effectively there is no difference on the long term effect. You know it, I know it, everybody with some insight in the game knows it.
As somebody else pointed out, they will become resource locked at some point in time too. Which is fine in itself, but at least people would have had a choice in the matter.
Yes, the annoyance of choice being removed is EXACTLY the point I am making. It's not the first time this has been done and I can't help but feel that playing this game is slowly becoming a "one size fits all" kind of playstyle. Back when I joined people were discussing the pro's, con's and methods of being a merchant or a fighter, or even a hybrid. Not anymore.
Also, I got through Halflings comfortably with just 35 AW levels. I have only been adding and upping a few AW for elementals, but even with 38 AW levels right now, I am comfortably progressing. You don't even NEED them, as you say, they just speed things along a good bit.
It's possible that Inno now wants people to have more AW levels for whatever it is they have planned for AFTER elementals. But as I have said before to Inno; please communicate your plans and roadmap so that we can better understand the changes you are implementing. It prevents displeasure amongst your players
Unfortunately, it has fallen on very deaf ears. As you said; it will not change.
LazyTony
Sorcerer
The difference is that the KP injection is available twice a week (round 2 and round 5 of tourney) and is finite and not enough to finish most techs. General purpose instants could be used anytime and have no maximum, round 2 and round 5 of a tourney can provide 50-80 KP only, at a time not of your choosing, at a high cost in troops and goods. So, yes, a big difference.
Well done. Really well done. Managing those seeds must be a real pain. This info also explains why you are so upset, as wonders obviously aren't your thing
In an ideal world we would be able to choose with every wonder or tourney reward to take a lower amount of KP bar KP or a higher amount of instants KP. That way both of us would get our preference.
Killiak
Artisan
I am talking about the tourney overall, and I would be most interested (for recruitment purposes) in the chapter 2 or 3 player who can get himself into round 5 of the second page.
Furthermore, those KP's won't finish any tech as there is also a resource cost. Basically, people saving up these theoretical KP instants will still be just as locked as you and me used to be, the difference being that they actually had a choice where to invest them.
I can see it now;
"Timmy Fellow; I saved up 800 KP instants for the next chapter!"
"Archy Mage; That's nice, do you also have all the Dwarf goods?"
"Timmy Fellow; uuuhhh. damn."
"Archy Mage; I know right? Now go put 400 of those in an AW. It's good for you!"
As I said; there won't be a long term difference for the tech tree if these KP instants had been generic instead of AW locked. Of course that does assume there would have been no increase in the reward, which we are getting now. Which, by the way, I assume is a compensation for the fact that the rewards are being AW locked.
But again; perhaps this change is needed for something they planned down the road. If they would just communicate that, then I'd have far (FAR!) less issues with our choices being cut.
That would be lovely, but I doubt that is easilly added/coded.
DeletedUser
Guest
Sure, you can howl at the moon for as long as you like
The problem with aggressiveness is that it can be taken by more than just one person, I took exception to your post and so replied in the same vein.
As the AM of 2 FS which are vastly different, one being a higher level FS with people of a higher level and the other being a new starter's FS where we are continually taking new people and once they get to a certain point they move to the next FS of the group.
In the new starter FS some don't care and some aren't happy, but they definitely aren't all happy.
In the FS where people are of a higher level they aren't all happy there either, its not about whether its going to happen or not, its great that Inno have solved the "full kp bar" issue when being away from the game, but its how it was chosen to be done.
It seems very difficult to try to explain this to you... its about taking away the choice!
LazyTony
Sorcerer
About 20 posts ago. In a post of mine you already quoted.
DeletedUser6458
Guest
Only if a player is not doing research and is staying at one level thinking only of tourneys would 5-6k be possible with "no pain". I am finding I can do more points on a regular basis after elementals than before so my experience is telling me you guys are missing a lot of variables in your math equation. Sure things have got harder but I now have way more resources to deal with the tourney so it has a way of evening out...
Deleted User - 106219
Guest
For me it's a matter of principle. I like having a choice, so I would rather have 5 KP that I can spend where I want than 10 KP I can spend only on AWs.
- Tier III manufactories are still at level 23, so no increase in production - but the required amount of Tier III has increased due to the mandatory SS upgrades
- same goes for Tier II goods: manufactories are still at level 23, so no increase in production - but the required amount of Tier II has increased due to the mandatory SS upgrades
- due to the mandatory SS upgrades I need more units per squad, so I lose more units and thus need to train more units to replace the ones lost - but my Barracks and Mercenary Camp get no upgrades in Elementals, so I still train the exact same number of units as before. Thus I need more time to replace my losses
Overall, my choice is:
- do less at the same cost as before
OR
- do as much as before, but at a higher cost
Either way, the mandatory SS upgrades have made tournaments worse for me (and for many other players, apparently).
My experience is the EXACT OPPOSITE. Now the costs are higher, so I can do less. Not really surprising, when you think about it:
- Tier III manufactories are still at level 23, so no increase in production - but the required amount of Tier III has increased due to the mandatory SS upgrades
- same goes for Tier II goods: manufactories are still at level 23, so no increase in production - but the required amount of Tier II has increased due to the mandatory SS upgrades
- due to the mandatory SS upgrades I need more units per squad, so I lose more units and thus need to train more units to replace the ones lost - but my Barracks and Mercenary Camp get no upgrades in Elementals, so I still train the exact same number of units as before. Thus I need more time to replace my losses
Overall, my choice is:
- do less at the same cost as before
OR
- do as much as before, but at a higher cost
Either way, the mandatory SS upgrades have made tournaments worse for me (and for many other players, apparently).
DeletedUser6458
Guest
Like I said, you are missing a lot of variables in the equation here. I have been getting a very substantial increase in troops due to armory upgrades from elementals and every SS research has increased the number of free troops I receive from my AW's. Additionally the MH upgraded to 29 has affected a few AW effects as well. The training grounds increasing and becoming a good producer again has opened up my options for producing better troops for any given situation as well. The Troop upgrades from elementals have also improved performance and opened up more battle setup options. So by your view none of these things are factors?? Are we doing the same tourney??
Timneh
Artisan
All the people that are greatly in favour of the AW instants seem to be thinking that the only other option would be to have instants that can be used anywhere(or so it seems reading this thread). As i said earlier there is a way that Inno could have solved the KP bar filling up problem and still keep all players happy. All they had to do was introduce a notification and a claim button for the KP rewards, players could clear their KP bar before claiming the reward and then clear their KP bar again after claiming and that way they would not lose any hourly KP. Players could still put the KP into AWs if they wanted to but also use them in the tech tree if they wanted to. My friends son works for a big games company and he says the coding would be simple to do
This solution was asked for but Inno chose to adopt a change that has made some players happy and others not happy.
It is the removal of my freedom of choice that i object to in this change.
This solution was asked for but Inno chose to adopt a change that has made some players happy and others not happy.
It is the removal of my freedom of choice that i object to in this change.
DeletedUser6458
Guest
I agree that would be good option in terms of how it works for us but I immediately see server issues arising with this however simple the coding may be. It is just a lot of extra info for the servers to keep track of and we already have enough lag issues.