Question Pilgrims Forge - other means to get it?

[Pauly7]

I open the game almost every hour a day, that means I collect almost all the SK that falls within my city. I did all the episodic event quests, and even won some extra SKs in some chests, and I not even close to get the last part of the set.

Which beacons did you open? If you'd managed to (and it would never happen) always take the 18 beacon, then reaching the final building would be guaranteed, so long as you completed the quests and collected around 15 currency a day from around the city. I haven't calculated all the permutations, but I'm pretty sure you'd still be guaranteed it if you only opened 18 and 45 beacons. Most of the other ones carry with them an element of risk. If you always opened the 80 beacon, but didn't win any bonus scrolls from them, then you'd almost certainly fail to reach the end.

As I say, it's tight. I figured that around 40% of people who do everything right (including opening the right beacons) won't find the final building, unless they use diamonds. That's a pretty huge number.

When this even played out on Beta all the quest rewards were greater, as was the daily bonus. Finishing the set wasn't guaranteed, but if you were sensible you'd probably do it. I thought it was balanced quite nicely that way. Clearly this didn't bring in enough revenue and they nerfed the rewards. They want people to dip into diamond reserves or spend more money.

 

[Pauly7]

My guess is that this kind of unpredictability will become more commonplace. I figure that they're now trying to counterbalance how readily available diamonds are from the Spire by making it so that they're almost required to complete events.

Really this isn't new. Three or four years ago events used to have 3 main grand prizes and it used to be set up so that the third grand prize was very nearly impossible to win without spending a good amount of diamonds on it. The pity with this is that it's a set and they've made it so that one of the buildings that will be important to people is the last one in the chain. That will be on purpose to promote more spending. If the last building was the mana building or one of the 4x1 ones, then they wouldn't be so necessary.

In my city I wanted to place this set a bit differently to the norm so that it was more square. I've missed out one of those long thin buildings and it was still perfectly possible to activate all the link bonuses of the remaining six. It would not be fun to be missing the Forge though so I feel for anyone who is going to miss it.

 

[DeletedUser501]

My guess is that this kind of unpredictability will become more commonplace. I figure that they're now trying to counterbalance how readily available diamonds are from the Spire by making it so that they're almost required to complete events.

Really this isn't new. Three or four years ago events used to have 3 main grand prizes and it used to be set up so that the third grand prize was very nearly impossible to win without spending a good amount of diamonds on it. The pity with this is that it's a set and they've made it so that one of the buildings that will be important to people is the last one in the chain. That will be on purpose to promote more spending. If the last building was the mana building or one of the 4x1 ones, then they wouldn't be so necessary.

In my city I wanted to place this set a bit differently to the norm so that it was more square. I've missed out one of those long thin buildings and it was still perfectly possible to activate all the link bonuses of the remaining six. It would not be fun to be missing the Forge though so I feel for anyone who is going to miss it.

I would like to know in what sense they are now requiring much more revenue.
- It is they are suffering an economical crisis? In this matter they in fact are urged to get a higher income from whatever places they can find within the game.
- It is that they are getting more than enough revenue, but they are urged of greediness to get much more of what they need?

Could you please tell us in what sense this is directed @Silmaril ? Just a rink of the actual financial situation of InnoGames regarding Elvenar game?

Would we get this kind of situation in the near future?

Do we have to worry about the potential end of Elvenar due to financial problems?

 

[Pauly7]

- It is they are suffering an economical crisis? In this matter they in fact are urged to get a higher income from whatever places they can find within the game.
- It is that they are getting more than enough revenue, but they are urged of greediness to get much more of what they need?

What I meant above is that possibly they have been getting a lower revenue from diamond sales because they now give away so many of them. In the old days it wasn't possible to get any unless you bought them.

 

[DeletedUser501]

What I meant above is that possibly they have been getting a lower revenue from diamond sales because they now give away so many of them. In the old days it wasn't possible to get any unless you bought them.

Personally I don´t see diamonds are that easy to get, I´m always low in diamonds, I´ve bought some of them when there are good offers. Yes, Spire gives them for free, but these quantities Spire gives are not that high to justify pushing players to buy more of them. In my point of view there´s something behind these bad changes, i think is purely greed.

 

[Gargon667]

Well I never, ever, since I started playing this game, have failed in completing the maximun numbers of artifacts / parts AVAILABLE to achieve for a Evo.Building/ Set. No matter what type of chests or mix of chest I have picked up in those events I could get the full available pieces/ artifacts, now in this new event, I just found out I won´t be able to get the last piece (Pilgrim Forge). EVEN AFTER WINNING AROUND 560 EXTRA SKs!!!

Not sure what you are trying to say?

If you are saying that this event is more difficult for completion of the grand prize than previous events then yes I would agree. I think there will be more people not completing the set than usual.

It also means that you either chose the wrong boxes or that you had bad luck. In previous events choosing the wrong boxes did not matter much. I often chose boxes for more daily prizes and still managed to complete all grand prizes. In this event I would not have managed with the daily prize boxes. So this event gives a smaller margin. It still works, but for fewer people than we are used to.

 

[Gargon667]

Personally I don´t see diamonds are that easy to get, I´m always low in diamonds, I´ve bought some of them when there are good offers. Yes, Spire gives them for free, but these quantities Spire gives are not that high to justify pushing players to buy more of them. In my point of view there´s something behind these bad changes, i think is purely greed.

I feel exactly the opposite, the spire (and MO) gives out so many, that I have far more diamonds than I need. Of course I am not complaining, but the need for diamonds will certainly not make me buy any more. I now treat this as donations to a game I like. Not because I need diamonds.

 

[Pauly7]

Personally I don´t see diamonds are that easy to get, I´m always low in diamonds

I feel exactly the opposite, the spire (and MO) gives out so many, that I have far more diamonds than I need

This all depends on your spending habits and how many you have coming in. It's a lot like real life. I always feel like I'm low on money in my bank account, but does that mean I'm not getting paid? No, someone's paying me all right.

I was usually low on diamonds, always spending most of what I had coming in on silly little things. You don't notice yourself doing it, but I was always fluctuating from somewhere between zero to a thousand diamonds. More recently (since two months ago) I started making a concerted effort to save diamonds and never spend them unless I absolutely had to. Now I have almost 9,000 in my account.

 

[CrazyWizard]

@Pauly7: I am a relatively new player, like most other players I talked to, and like most on the servers. Have you noticed that 9 out of 10 players here abandon the game soon? Some would anyway. Some however are chased of by what they perceive as unfairness. Accepting it is your right. However, it doesn't mean that everyone would, or should.

@Gargon667: Look at the quote you are giving:

"The questline consists of a story section and additional episodic quests, which start as soon as the story is completed. This means that you will be able to finish the first series of quests right away, while later quests have new additions released on a daily basis, allowing you to continue to play 1 additional event quest on each new event day."

the wordt "section" means "a part of" so those 75 quests are aviable for this event,
A part of those 75 (50 and a bit) are storyline quests, the other 20 something are aditional episodic quest, each day of the event 1 of those unlocks with the last quest unlocking on the last full day.

 

[CrazyWizard]

I open the game almost every hour a day, that means I collect almost all the SK that falls within my city. I did all the episodic event quests, and even won some extra SKs in some chests, and I not even close to get the last part of the set.

That part of the set (pilgrim forge) is in the position of another base of a Evo building from other event ( I can name several of them ), because this time the parts were separated by 2 in the grand prize section.

They are very very very easy to get if:

• You are active in the spire, aka 2 levels or a full spire each week
• When your fellowship also reaches 2 levels or a full spire.

I play on 2 worlds both gold spires, boith reaching the top and I get a little under 1000 diamonds a week on average from the spire alone.
That accumulates very fast into large numbers if you are one of those players in that situation.

 

[Sir Derf]

Yes, we know that it's a part of the 75, as in 50+/20+ split. The question is how a newer player would know it is that versus 98 with a 75/20+ split.

 

[sentimil]

This thread becomes pretty long, with most of us talking about different things and then wondering why we cannot agree on them.

I am willing to put all that down to misunderstanding by me and some other players of what has been said. I can see that Inno put some effort to explain the switch between the quest timings. Whether this effort fails in some cases because of Inno's or players' fault is not that important to me. There is goodwill present, and I believe that one should value this.

I raised before that the question that chests are designed so the better cost you choose, the less is your chance to earn extra SK. Thinking of it, this might be an attempt by Inno to decrease the chance element, thus increasing the role of the player's skill. I can only commend such a decision: to me it appears a wise one.

My doubts are still not allayed completely, but I will give here the credit of the doubt. Nobody is perfect. I might be mistaken. Inno might be honestly mistaken, and it would not be fair to stack it against them.

For those interested, "buying" the Forge means getting 20 points (assuming that you are just at the beginning of it). These can be obtained on average at a cost of about 23 SK per point, or 460 SK total. 500 SK cost 2250 diamonds, and 2400 diamonds cost EUR19.99. This is a small part of what Inno deserves per player for this game. To me it appears that paying for it would be giving credit where credit is due - so I will consider it.

@DunkelSaturn: That is a bit strange to me. I am a new and inexperienced player, thus my choices probably weren't always optimal. Also, during the first about 10 quests I believed that the questline reflects the number of beacon choices one can make, thus using a clearly wrong strategy. Cannot remember if I won extra SK once, or never. Despite these, I am doing already the Forge part, which is the last part of the set.

Do you have some recollection on how you went through it? I am curious what might have delayed you.

 

[Sir Derf]

They are very very very easy to get if:

• You are active in the spire, aka 2 levels or a full spire each week
• When your fellowship also reaches 2 levels or a full spire.

I play on 2 worlds both gold spires, boith reaching the top and I get a little under 1000 diamonds a week on average from the spire alone.
That accumulates very fast into large numbers if you are one of those players in that situation.

1000 diamonds a week from the spire? On average? Could you please break that down for me... I'm having a hard time picturing that.

 

[CrazyWizard]

1000 diamonds a week from the spire? On average? Could you please break that down for me... I'm having a hard time picturing that.

I had a breakdown a long long time ago when they changed the rewards not sure I still got the picture it's 4xx per spire.
50+75+125=250 fixed and the rest variable.
Then 2 worlds so the reward twice, once for each world.

 

[Sir Derf]

Ah. I play in only one world, so didn't consider the triple right off the top.

 

[sentimil]

Which beacons did you open? If you'd managed to (and it would never happen) always take the 18 beacon, then reaching the final building would be guaranteed, so long as you completed the quests and collected around 15 currency a day from around the city. I haven't calculated all the permutations, but I'm pretty sure you'd still be guaranteed it if you only opened 18 and 45 beacons. Most of the other ones carry with them an element of risk. If you always opened the 80 beacon, but didn't win any bonus scrolls from them, then you'd almost certainly fail to reach the end.

Always taking the 18 beacon might not be the best strategy, as sometimes you are presented next with 30-54-89 or similar choices. In this case it might have been wiser to open the 45 beacon, thus taking 2 points per 22.5 SK, and avoiding to take down the line points per 30 or 27 SK. It depends on either your luck, or on how the game is programmed to react on you choosing the 18 SK beacon, if it is tailored to present choices based on this.

 

[Sir Derf]

Yes, you can't 'always take the 27', as you aren't always presented the 27. And you can't 'always take the 89'. Those two scenarios were used to run the math to compare the two, to prove that if presented with both, whether you should prefer one over the other. Obviously, if presented with 30-54-89, you can't pick the 27. You should pick the 89.

 

[Pauly7]

For those interested, "buying" the Forge means getting 20 points (assuming that you are just at the beginning of it). These can be obtained on average at a cost of about 23 SK per point, or 460 SK total. 500 SK cost 2250 diamonds, and 2400 diamonds cost EUR19.99. This is a small part of what Inno deserves per player for this game. To me it appears that paying for it would be giving credit where credit is due - so I will consider it.

There will be a promotion (possibly tomorrow) to buy SK at a much cheaper rate. It always happens.

Always taking the 18 beacon might not be the best strategy, as sometimes you are presented next with 30-54-89 or similar choices.

Are you suggesting that taking one beacon makes it less likely to appear the next time. I think that's some advanced computations that Inno is unlikely to wade into, even if they saw a benefit.

as sometimes you are presented next with 30-54-89 or similar choices

In this case take the 89. It's not a bad choice. Avoid 30 and 54 like the plague if you want the staffs.

 

[CrazyWizard]

Always taking the 18 beacon might not be the best strategy, as sometimes you are presented next with 30-54-89 or similar choices. In this case it might have been wiser to open the 45 beacon, thus taking 2 points per 22.5 SK, and avoiding to take down the line points per 30 or 27 SK. It depends on either your luck, or on how the game is programmed to react on you choosing the 18 SK beacon, if it is tailored to present choices based on this.

if there was the option always taking 18 would be the absolute best strategy to get a full set + more as it would guarantee a full set at 4680 points, which is way below the 5500-5900 currency you can get during an event without external sources.

 

[DeletedUser501]

Not sure what you are trying to say?

If you are saying that this event is more difficult for completion of the grand prize than previous events then yes I would agree. I think there will be more people not completing the set than usual.

It also means that you either chose the wrong boxes or that you had bad luck. In previous events choosing the wrong boxes did not matter much. I often chose boxes for more daily prizes and still managed to complete all grand prizes. In this event I would not have managed with the daily prize boxes. So this event gives a smaller margin. It still works, but for fewer people than we are used to.

Yes, and yes, events. are getting more a more pay to win stuff, the margin you´re talking about shouldnt has been that tiny and narrow, since many players (especially new) won´t get the whole set, I bet they won´t even get the penultimate piece.

This is bad for me, this is bad for new comers this is bad for diamond spenders, this is bad for the game in general. Vertich.