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Version 1.146
- Thread starter anonglitch
- Start date
DeletedUser501
Enchanter
One question about the wholesaler update.
In one part of your post you write that sentient goods will be adjusted to 1:1.5. Could you explain it a little more specifically this please?
That same adjustment of 1:1.5 would be applied also to standard goods?
In one part of your post you write that sentient goods will be adjusted to 1:1.5. Could you explain it a little more specifically this please?
That same adjustment of 1:1.5 would be applied also to standard goods?
Pauly7
Magus
That is weird, and concerning. I can't say I've had any diamonds since they made the change to nerf the diamond odds, but I haven't opened enough to be able to tell if anything strange is happening.
Laurelin
Sorcerer
@C-Nymph :
I don't know whether you've grown tired of waiting and just opened up more of your stored Mystery Objects - although I'd be interested to know the results if you have, and if you want to share the info - and I'd be just as interested in hearing how everyone else is doing with the new Mystery Objects too, if anyone feels like it? However, just to add my bit to this topic, I've just opened 20 Mystery Objects, and won:
- 1 x 500 Diamonds (Hooray! That's 1 x Artifact when I inevitably fall short, whether in this Event - looking likely, or the next - probably more so!);
- 4 x 35 KPs;
- 2 or 3 (not sure) x sets of Time Boosters;
... and nothing else worth mentioning - although the selection is now so underwhelming (politely stated, there...), in my not-very-humble-opinion, that MOST of it isn't really worth mentioning if you're past the earliest Guest Races, where Pop & Culture buildings really aren't what they once were (unless that's your whole strategy, of course, which it isn't for the typical player).
I will, however, mention (without much joy!) that I won one each of what I consider to be the two worst prizes of all, i.e. 4 x Smallest Room and 4 x Light Melee Battalion (yes, that's forty Squads of useless Sword Dancers - they're only worth [base] 108 SF even to Disenchant)... especially because the Light Melee are in the same chest as a chance of Diamonds, which is frankly just annoying even to look at on the screen, let alone to win!
Sorry for the vagueness - in fact, although too late (about halfway through) - I realised that I should have written down all of the outcomes, so I could post them all here, and it will take me a while to save up another 20 more Mystery Objects to try again. For what it's worth, though, I also opened 20 M. Objects immediately before the changes were made which reduced the odds of winning Diamonds by 45% overall (according to Beta maths experts), and while opening those Objects I did win the Diamonds four times (so 20% overall as expected), whereas this time my win rate is not 10% as I'd also hoped, given so many attempts, but only 5%. And while I am more than well aware that averages are exactly that, and therefore I shouldn't expect to actually win 10% Diamonds all the time, it still isn't very much fun winning so few Diamonds after such a long time saving up for the chance!
Oh well. Inno's RNG never did like me very much... I was amazed to win so many Diamonds even once (although it was spot-on average) the first time!
I don't know whether you've grown tired of waiting and just opened up more of your stored Mystery Objects - although I'd be interested to know the results if you have, and if you want to share the info - and I'd be just as interested in hearing how everyone else is doing with the new Mystery Objects too, if anyone feels like it? However, just to add my bit to this topic, I've just opened 20 Mystery Objects, and won:
- 1 x 500 Diamonds (Hooray! That's 1 x Artifact when I inevitably fall short, whether in this Event - looking likely, or the next - probably more so!);
- 4 x 35 KPs;
- 2 or 3 (not sure) x sets of Time Boosters;
... and nothing else worth mentioning - although the selection is now so underwhelming (politely stated, there...), in my not-very-humble-opinion, that MOST of it isn't really worth mentioning if you're past the earliest Guest Races, where Pop & Culture buildings really aren't what they once were (unless that's your whole strategy, of course, which it isn't for the typical player).
I will, however, mention (without much joy!) that I won one each of what I consider to be the two worst prizes of all, i.e. 4 x Smallest Room and 4 x Light Melee Battalion (yes, that's forty Squads of useless Sword Dancers - they're only worth [base] 108 SF even to Disenchant)... especially because the Light Melee are in the same chest as a chance of Diamonds, which is frankly just annoying even to look at on the screen, let alone to win!
Sorry for the vagueness - in fact, although too late (about halfway through) - I realised that I should have written down all of the outcomes, so I could post them all here, and it will take me a while to save up another 20 more Mystery Objects to try again. For what it's worth, though, I also opened 20 M. Objects immediately before the changes were made which reduced the odds of winning Diamonds by 45% overall (according to Beta maths experts), and while opening those Objects I did win the Diamonds four times (so 20% overall as expected), whereas this time my win rate is not 10% as I'd also hoped, given so many attempts, but only 5%. And while I am more than well aware that averages are exactly that, and therefore I shouldn't expect to actually win 10% Diamonds all the time, it still isn't very much fun winning so few Diamonds after such a long time saving up for the chance!
Oh well. Inno's RNG never did like me very much... I was amazed to win so many Diamonds even once (although it was spot-on average) the first time!
Sir Derf
Adept
I don't have the MA base odds available at my fingertips, so I can't compute the semi-pointless math, but while 2 Diamonds out of 20 Mystical Objects might be the expected out come, it is probably not that much higher of a possibility as 1 Diamonds out of 20 Mystical Objects. Disappointing, yes, but less unusual of an occurrence than you probably think.
Since this last update for the Mystical Object, there have been no changes to the odds, so you have the same odds to win those Diamonds.
However, please remember that back in Version 1.146, we added new prizes, including Spectral Stones! Therefore, the odds of more prizes are greater.
However, please remember that back in Version 1.146, we added new prizes, including Spectral Stones! Therefore, the odds of more prizes are greater.
Killiak
Artisan
I am curious about the system used to determine the reward you will get.
Do you know if it is a simple 'd100' system, were the prizes are divided among the various 'sides' of the virtual die, in accordance to their chance?
Roll once, and see what it lands on?
Laurelin
Sorcerer
@Sir Derf : I'm absolutely no mathematician, so what I've said above is the analysis of the Beta Forum players who are usually right when it comes to such calculations - although there was, in fact, some early disagreement on Beta about the precise difference between the 'old and new' Mystical Object odds of winning Diamonds and Time Boosters in particular (these being the most popular prizes overall), and in addition, I don't think anyone actually calculated the odds of winning ALL of the prizes. Fortunately those same players also provided the 'old and new' odds for all possible prizes, so if you really don't mind calculating out the odds, here they are - I'd certainly love to know, and I expect others would, too:
OLD Mystical Object % Chances (image by CrazyWizard):
NEW Mystical Object % Chances (image by Karvest):
@anonglitch : I hate to be 'that person' - and I don't know whether you're also a mathematician, either - but the above two images do show that while there are indeed more types of prize now available, the odds of winning any given one of them has actually changed in all cases between 'old and new' Mystical Objects. The chance of winning Diamonds was reduced not only per M.Object in some cases (from 20% to 10%), but also overall (i.e. in terms of how many times Diamonds can be won per full rotation of the Mystical Object sequence, which repeats identically rather than randomly), not least because there is now one more M.Object in the rotation which contains no Diamonds at all, compared with the previous rotation.
@Pauly7 : I didn't win any Spectral Stones during my 20-M.O. trial run, although I also thought that they'd be much more useful to me than they have turned out to be. I'm in Halflings, and my non-Barracks Troops are still too weak to deal with most of Stage III of the Spire, so I sometimes end up doing more Diplomacy than a whole week's worth of production can even replace at the moment - if I even brave Stage III at all!
That said, I often find the three-wave Spire Boss battles easier than the one- or two-wave fights, since the Enemy Squad Sizes are usefully lower and even my mid-quality Troops survive better as a result - but I'd imagine that if I do have to use Diplomacy to pass the Frog or the Golem, one or two Spectral Stones might save me some valuable Orcs and/or decaying Resources. Still - Spectral Stones aren't the panacea I'd imagined they'd be, and the same can be said of Sips of Clarity, too... I have 22 of those just from Events (none from Spire yet), and I've only used one - by accident!
OLD Mystical Object % Chances (image by CrazyWizard):
NEW Mystical Object % Chances (image by Karvest):
@anonglitch : I hate to be 'that person' - and I don't know whether you're also a mathematician, either - but the above two images do show that while there are indeed more types of prize now available, the odds of winning any given one of them has actually changed in all cases between 'old and new' Mystical Objects. The chance of winning Diamonds was reduced not only per M.Object in some cases (from 20% to 10%), but also overall (i.e. in terms of how many times Diamonds can be won per full rotation of the Mystical Object sequence, which repeats identically rather than randomly), not least because there is now one more M.Object in the rotation which contains no Diamonds at all, compared with the previous rotation.
@Pauly7 : I didn't win any Spectral Stones during my 20-M.O. trial run, although I also thought that they'd be much more useful to me than they have turned out to be. I'm in Halflings, and my non-Barracks Troops are still too weak to deal with most of Stage III of the Spire, so I sometimes end up doing more Diplomacy than a whole week's worth of production can even replace at the moment - if I even brave Stage III at all!
That said, I often find the three-wave Spire Boss battles easier than the one- or two-wave fights, since the Enemy Squad Sizes are usefully lower and even my mid-quality Troops survive better as a result - but I'd imagine that if I do have to use Diplomacy to pass the Frog or the Golem, one or two Spectral Stones might save me some valuable Orcs and/or decaying Resources. Still - Spectral Stones aren't the panacea I'd imagined they'd be, and the same can be said of Sips of Clarity, too... I have 22 of those just from Events (none from Spire yet), and I've only used one - by accident!
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Silly Bubbles
Necromancer
Yes, the chance of winning diamonds have halved based on new mystery objects. I think that they tried to offset the benefits of Red Panda that can in some cases quadruple the amount of vision vapor from crafting as it gives 3 bonus VV per crafted object when fed. It does take a lot of time boosters to get full advantage of that but when really wanted the odds of winning diamonds can still be made higher than before Panda and this change.
Silly Bubbles
Necromancer
Sir Derf
Adept
Thank you for the info... begin the semi-pointless math...
One win of Diamonds in 20 Mystical Objects is the most likely outcome, at about 39% chance.
Average Diamond return from 20 Mystical Objects is 600, or about 1.2 wins in 20.
10 MO lineups. Four offering 500 diamonds, two at 10% odds, two at 20% odds.
Most likely outcome, 51.84% chance of getting no diamonds in a full round of 10 Mystical Objects.
Average Diamond return from 10 Mystical Objects is 300, or about 0.6 wins in 10.
| # of Diamond wins in a rotation of 10 Mystical Objects | Odds |
|---|---|
0 | 51.84% |
1 | 37.44% |
2 | 9.64% |
3 | 1.04% |
4 | 0.04% |
Most likely outcome, 51.84% chance of getting no diamonds in a full round of 10 Mystical Objects.
Average Diamond return from 10 Mystical Objects is 300, or about 0.6 wins in 10.
| # of Diamond wins in a rotation of 20 Mystical Objects | Odds |
|---|---|
0 | 26.873856% |
1 | 38.817792% |
2 | 24.012288% |
3 | 8.296704% |
4 | 1.749520% |
5 | 0.230464% |
6 | 0.018528% |
7 | 0.000832% |
8 | 0.000016% |
One win of Diamonds in 20 Mystical Objects is the most likely outcome, at about 39% chance.
Average Diamond return from 20 Mystical Objects is 600, or about 1.2 wins in 20.
Jake65
Sage
Love the allergy warning