On the Seeds income side, three of my cities provide just under 10k per day, and one gives 11700. Note - all of my cities are 200k+ points, if a smaller city reaches Elementals, I'd assume they get less than that (due to fewer AW / provinces, etc). There's also the bonus seeds (approx 1000) per collection, which I normally do twice a day - so total of 12-14k seeds per day. And then your total amount of seeds gets hit by 10% decay each day. The level 24 manufactory requires 3200 seeds per 9 hour production of sentient goods. Run 2x9hr per day, and that will cost 6400 seeds. Have two manufactories (because even upgrading the manufactory to level 25 needs 20k each of two sentient goods), and that's 12800 seeds per day - more than you're receiving ! And remember that you need seeds for more than just goods production : - unlocking new techs takes large amounts of seeds - 20k here, 35k there, and so on. - the new culture buildings take seeds to build - and a painful one that I just encountered, while upgrading your Trader (which, again, doesn't bring any increase in Seeds production), you can't collect any seeds, but your total still decays ! (of course, you could only run one manufactory for sentient goods - but again, look at the quantities of sentient goods required to do any upgrades and unlock techs, compared to the production of one manufactory, especially before you unlock the boost (oh, that's 35k seeds, btw ). It'll take half of forever !) I repeat my claim: The Seeds economy figures don't add up. The Seeds economy is broken, and most players will be spending a very long time waiting for enough Seeds to build up to do anything. (Assuming they haven't run out of Mana, of course ... ) If anyone from Inno is actually paying attention to feedback: Please, at least make the upgraded Trader produce more seeds. What else am I using those 750 people for, if not to boost production ?!