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Spire imbalance for cities in later chapters

Fyrebird

Spellcaster
I've just started Constructs. I've always fought the first level of spire, but due to the great incentive of getting phoenix artifacts, I've completed the spire for a few weeks now. This has really highlighted several issues for me:
  • Enemy troop size - unless you are fully boosted with dwarven armorer, various buffs & have fed your fire phoenix, you can forget about winning anything beyond first level (and please don't recommend I start manual fighting cos I have a life outside of Elvenar!) Having a level 16 sanctuary & level 8 forge is just not cutting it for me and all I now focus on is just upgrading them and nothing else.
  • Troop demand - I really don't know how players manage to compete well in BOTH spire and tourney every week, I just can't keep up with the supplies and troop demand.
  • Catering costs - as a larger city who normally fights, I have a surplus of standard goods, but when I am forced to cater the demand is more for sentient goods, seeds, mana and orcs. While having only 1 manufactory for a sentient good is said to be enough to get you through the chapter, I now find I'm perpetually struggling to progress through research, or upgrade buildings requiring orcs/sentient goods due to shortage.
  • Frustrating - I find myself getting bored and tired of continuously having to gamble my resources and getting hit and miss rewards (sometimes I've tried and failed up to 6 times with a negotiation).

I realise there have been rant posts about spire before, so I would like to be positive and recommend that prizes of buildings offering sentient goods, seeds etc be made more available to larger cities if you'd like us to continue doing spire runs at it's current settings. Cos I'm seriously funned out and feel exhausted by this game right now. I realise as you progress in any game it should be more challenging, but either I'm doing something radically wrong or something is just not right. I can now understand why players are either taking a break from the game or quitting completely.
 

Pauly7

Magus
Now, more than ever it is really important to balance your city well as you progress through the game. With the spire and the tournament the formula is designed (either accidentally or not) to hurt you more and more if you progress without due forethought. The further a player progresses, often the more unnecessary AW levels they have, the more unnecessary expansions they may have, amongst other things and it all gets amplified exponentially by all the researches you are completing on the tech tree.

I am not sure what your specific situation is, or how you play the game, but you may notice if you decide to halt any game progression for a while, don't take new expansions and only level the AWs that will definitely help the cause of your fighting efforts (Sanctuary/Monastery, Needles, Flying Academy, Temple of the Toads, Dragon Abbey), then you will gradually notice it becoming a bit easier again.

For a while now I haven't progressed at all through the game. I am levelling the above Wonders, along with Simia Sapiens, and I have also deleted some of the ones that hurt my game (Endless Excavation, Thrones, Watchtower, Lighthouse of Good Neighbourhood, Sunset Towers). I am noticing things getting steadily easier.
 

Gargon667

Mentor
AS you say there are many discussions on this topic, if you look in there you´ll find a lot of arguing back and forth.

I personally find the spire a very relaxing experience, it is so much easier than the tourneys :) and it is my main source of resources. I don´t think any other part of the game now produces as many resources as the spire does.
I never even get close to losing a fight. I get annoyed when I loose a squad lol. And the convincing minigame I play simply because I enjoy the mastermind game :)

How it is possible? I have built my city for it, and I play the game very actively. Other than that i cannot say that I do anything fancy. It must be something like 2 years ago that I last spent real money ingame, back then about the amount of money I´d spend on a normal board game I would guess. Anyway I use the resources the game gives me and using those I can easily maintain a 10k tourney average finish the spire every week and build up my resources at the same time for special weeks like FAs or when I like this week want to score a 20k tourney.

As I said I built my city for fighting. If you wanted more specific tips I would need more specific information. But I am happy to help out if there is a problem you need solving.

From what you say: Forge? Do you mean heroes forge? Sure a nice enough AW, that I liked quite a lot, but I have deleted it to make fighting easier. You upgrading is sure not going to help! The MM on the other hand I can recommend wholeheartedly, mine is maxed out.

Your supply issue is normal at your stage, it will disappear as soon as you start chapter 15. Every WS you have will triple in efficiency then. Normal WS are still not worth writing home about, but Magic WS become a really good way to produce supplies. I am running 2 MWS (plus a 21 PTowers) and with PoP 24/7 they produce all the supplies I need for both tourneys and spire. And you get the MWS from finishing 2 levels in the spire (or from diamonds you get in a gold medal FS).

Catering costs: Well I find them rather low in the spire and so silly high in the tourney that I never bother with it (except in a very few cases, say 5 encounters a week). I think your goods needs depend mainly on other things than your spire. if you paly chapters you need goods, if you cater tourneys you need goods. Stop doing those two and you´ll find the spire becomes childs play :)

Frustration: I can see it becoming frustrating if you try to do everything at the same time. But I don´t see the need to do that at all! Pick and choose the parts of the game you enjoy most. Build your city to do the part you enjoy most and ignore the rest, whatever it is you want to do will bevery easy and enjoyable.
Occasionally I have to start a convincing minigame over many times, it just happens (although in these cases it usually involves me not liking the result in turn 1 and starting over directly). But this is a rare occurrence. Usually I need 1-3 tries to finish in 3 turns. AS long as there are not more than 6 resources I just try as many times as it takes. I don´t spend diamonds on buying a turn unless there is more than 6 possible resources (which is exactly 5 encounters per week) and then I only spend 25 diamonds for 1 extra turn if already know the solution (like if I had a 50% chance in turn 3 and guessed wrong).
If it is common for you to need more than say 3 tries, you may want to look into some tutorials how it works, it can take a while to wrap your head around the logics of the game. Some people of course never think, they just guess randomly, in that case I think convincing will be a rather expensive way of playing the spire, but I would argue it´s not that games fault if people refuse to think to make it cheaper... But there is still the fighting option for those :)

Manual fighting actually is a very reasonable tool in the spire. There are very few encounters overall, a total of 48 (4 encounters, 4 stages, 3 levels), Say a third are easy fights and you auto-fight them another third has resources you don´t mind using for convincing, leaves you with 15 or so encounters to manual fight, that is per week. Should take you less than an hour a week split up into 5 minutes here and there. Of course this is customizable to as much as you like. If you only manual fight the 3 most difficult encounters every week you can save lots of troops in 15 minutes :) Of course it helps if you enjoy the manual fights as I do. I just don´t have the time to manual fight hundreds of encounters in the tourney every week, so I only pick the highlights when I do have the time :D
 

30158729

Spellcaster
@Gargon667

While I agree its not difficult to finish the spire and perform strongly in the tournaments with proper planning it seems disingenuous for you to talk like its so easy while having so many booster buildings in your city. I know this is because you are pushing for a big tournament score this week but still. Having 5 booster buildings a week is unsustainable unless you spend diamonds on re-rolls. If you want to make your mini game a bit harder try it with 0. You'll certainly lose more than a squad then.
 

Gargon667

Mentor
@Gargon667

While I agree its not difficult to finish the spire and perform strongly in the tournaments with proper planning it seems disingenuous for you to talk like its so easy while having so many booster buildings in your city. I know this is because you are pushing for a big tournament score this week but still. Having 5 booster buildings a week is unsustainable unless you spend diamonds on re-rolls. If you want to make your mini game a bit harder try it with 0. You'll certainly lose more than a squad then.
What can I say, I use less booster buildings than I make, because my inventory keeps growing :) Yes flipping the academy sure helps with that, but I only use the diamonds I get from the spire every week, so I find it perfectly sustainable.
And you are right I never play a week without booster buildings, some weeks I place more than others as you say, weeks when I want to score more than my normal 10k. But why would I play a week without boosters? Am I supposed to stockpile hundreds of them in my inventory for the fun of how they look there? As I said overall I use fewer than what the game gives me already.

Btw even without booster buildings the spire isn´t much of a headache. I often finish (or start) a spire while my boosters are expired, I don´t time the boosters for the spire, but for the tourneys. I then either use more manual fighting and convincing instead of autofighting or the losses increase a bit when autofighting. My choice of troops changes too: with lots of ELR I can Ranger anything, while without I will choose troops like frogs that don´t need booster buildings, but only my firebird. Overall it doesn´t change anything in a major way.
 

Pauly7

Magus
You don't need booster buildings for the Spire. I always negotiate the whole thing - That's what my goods, tools, mana, etc, is being produced for. It's never an issue for me. The only thing that slows me down is the coins and supplies running out, so I tend to do just 2 or 3 or 4 sections at a time. In tournaments I solely fight. I can do it without any combat buildings and score about 7k. I will go anything up to 15k, though, depending on how many I decided to place that week.

In my small catering only city, I negotiate up the spire in one go each week and don't even notice anything running low (the full spire costs me about a third of my main hall capacity in tools and coins). So it is all possible. It's just a matter of being set up for it, with whichever tactic you are employing.
 

SoggyShorts

Necromancer
Having 5 booster buildings a week is unsustainable unless you spend diamonds on re-rolls.
I can't recall the DA odds, but according to Minmax, the MMM, ELR, and UUU are given out at over 80 per year without any MA flipping.
If you are smart and place them on a Thursday so that they cover 2 spires instead of 1, that's 240 boosted buildings placed 26 times, meaning that you can use 3 of each for every single spire plus however many DA's you get.

It's pre-coffee, but I'm pretty sure those numbers track and they explain why my stockpile of booster buildings is always going up and I've never flipped the MA.
 

30158729

Spellcaster
@SoggyShorts I don't care to get into the numbers as there is no way i'm putting in the work to refute someone elses. All i'm going to say is that I absolutely do not get 5 a week.

@Fyrebird If you are struggling with sentients then build another one.

As for troop demand it is a self sustaining cycle. I have lots of troops because I can use boosters on top of a never ending queue in the 3 buildings. I have boosters because I complete the spire each week. It's easier to complete the spire each week because I have lots of troops.
 

Fyrebird

Spellcaster
I am now reminded why I don't often write in forum. Here I am saying I'm struggling and all y'all can do is flex. People, I'm not a noob, I understand the difference between setting up your city for catering strategy or fighting strategy. Do you think that because Spire came into the picture that we suddenly don't have to optimise for space?? That mana rains from the sky and Pixies drop off supplies on our doorstep? You all need to dispense some real help... not tell me how marvelous you are... I'm sure you're already aware of that.
 
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Pauly7

Magus
Entirely uncalled for @Fyrebird. You listed reasons why the Spire seems too difficult and we offered possible reasons how you can combat those issues. If you choose to take the replies in that manner then that is fine, but I'll know not to bother responding in the future. What do you even want? For everyone to just say - yeah, you're right, the Spire's too difficult, don't even bother. Maybe, but then it would be pointless you posting it in the first place.
 

SoggyShorts

Necromancer
If advice isn't wanted I think posts should come with a disclaimer:
"I don't want any help on what I can do to fix the issue, I only want sympathy or for the developers to change things."
 

DunkelSaturn

Enchanter
If you are smart and place them on a Thursday so that they cover 2 spires instead of 1
Only for the people which are aiming only for the Spire and if they also want it working for the tourney they should have a well leveled Time-Warp and a polar bear, for the rest that have to wait 16 hrs per tourney round this won´t work since you will lose 2 days of tournament waiting for the other round of ELR, UUU, or MMM, so for the majority it is not worthy.
 

Gargon667

Mentor
That mana rains from the sky and Pixies drop off supplies on our doorstep?
Mana does rain from the sky if you have a Dragon Abbey
And pixies do drop of supplies on your doorstop when you reach chapter 15.

Anyway if you know how to set up your city do it and you´ll not have trouble with the spire anymore.
 

CrazyWizard

Shaman
I am now reminded why I don't often write in forum. Here I am saying I'm struggling and all y'all can do is flex. People, I'm not a noob, I understand the difference between setting up your city for catering strategy or fighting strategy. Do you think that because Spire came into the picture that we suddenly don't have to optimise for space?? That mana rains from the sky and Pixies drop off supplies on our doorstep? You all need to dispense some real help... not tell me how marvelous you are... I'm sure you're already aware of that.
if you only play the spire it's quite difficult.
But if you are already well versed in the tournaments the 2 enhance eachother.

Tournament give you knowledge points and loads and loads of spells, knowledge points can be used to improve ownders which improve your seed production. als the spells can be used to create instant mana and improve the coin and supply production.


The spire gives away a ton om timeboosters, these timeboosters can be used to create more troops to be used in the tournaments, which gives more knowledge points, and spells.

Those wonderlevels (seeds) and spells give you again more mana which allows you to ge further in the spire ect.
 
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30158729

Spellcaster
@Fyrebird

You make over 200k mana a day on each of your two cities. You have more than enough population or space for more population to support more sentient and/or supply production in each. You should be completing the spire without much difficulty. What do you want us to tell you?

The issue seems to be you cant do it with your current play style. This isn't something we can help you with. If you want to do better in the spire you'll need to put a bit more effort in.
 

Fyrebird

Spellcaster
@30158729 thank you for taking the time to check out my city on elvenstats, i'll now direct my questions to you (if you would indulge me :)).
I see that moving forward there is a lot more demand on sentient goods and seeds, less on standard goods... is this an ongoing trend? I also see you have 4 armories in your Winyador city... is this helping?

Would you advise me as one who prefers to FIGHT tourney & spire to:
  • lose some of my standard goods buildings to make space/population available to build another armory
  • build more sentient manus... and which? (currently I'm very short of obsidian/ink/velvet... does this change?)
  • have more seed production buildings.
  • is my mana production over-kill? Elvengems only advises according to city progress & research, not spire/tourney needs, so its flippen difficult for me to assess my needs... specially when I don't always understand WHAT I'll need in the future.
  • @Gargon667 also mentioned Heros Forge a waste of time, I'm terribly confused by that as currently I'm getting free orcs (which I badly need to produce Orc Warriors & Orc Strategists) and 115% boost to Heavy Melee damage.
  • Elvengems is very detailed about which wonders are for fighting strategy & which catering... but is there a hierarchy between wonders? ie, is it better to have some and not others of same category?

I do try craft boost buildings, but find I spend most of my catalysts on pet food & supply windfalls to keep up with troop demand. The amount of catalysts I'm actually winning from Spire is negligible. The dwarven armourers I win (maybe), I end up using for next Spire, so I'm not really gaining anything there, am I? I actually do put a hell of a lot of effort into Spire/tourney, which is why I'm exhausted and frustrated. It just seems the effort & resources used in Spire are not worth it... the stuff I win, I just use to battle the rest one... never-ending story.

@SoggyShorts I'm totally open to constructive and helpful criticism, I just get hella frustrated when everyone tells me this should be easy... like I'm sort of idiot for not realising this.

I understand that players can't see into my gameplay to assess that, but you CAN check out my city layout and see what's happening there. You can structure a response in a way that doesn't make me feel foolish.

Thank you
 

CrazyWizard

Shaman
@30158729 thank you for taking the time to check out my city on elvenstats, i'll now direct my questions to you (if you would indulge me :)).
I see that moving forward there is a lot more demand on sentient goods and seeds, less on standard goods... is this an ongoing trend? I also see you have 4 armories in your Winyador city... is this helping?

Would you advise me as one who prefers to FIGHT tourney & spire to:
  • lose some of my standard goods buildings to make space/population available to build another armory
  • build more sentient manus... and which? (currently I'm very short of obsidian/ink/velvet... does this change?)
  • have more seed production buildings.
  • is my mana production over-kill? Elvengems only advises according to city progress & research, not spire/tourney needs, so its flippen difficult for me to assess my needs... specially when I don't always understand WHAT I'll need in the future.
  • @Gargon667 also mentioned Heros Forge a waste of time, I'm terribly confused by that as currently I'm getting free orcs (which I badly need to produce Orc Warriors & Orc Strategists) and 115% boost to Heavy Melee damage.
  • Elvengems is very detailed about which wonders are for fighting strategy & which catering... but is there a hierarchy between wonders? ie, is it better to have some and not others of same category?

I do try craft boost buildings, but find I spend most of my catalysts on pet food & supply windfalls to keep up with troop demand. The amount of catalysts I'm actually winning from Spire is negligible. The dwarven armourers I win (maybe), I end up using for next Spire, so I'm not really gaining anything there, am I? I actually do put a hell of a lot of effort into Spire/tourney, which is why I'm exhausted and frustrated. It just seems the effort & resources used in Spire are not worth it... the stuff I win, I just use to battle the rest one... never-ending story.

@SoggyShorts I'm totally open to constructive and helpful criticism, I just get hella frustrated when everyone tells me this should be easy... like I'm sort of idiot for not realising this.

I understand that players can't see into my gameplay to assess that, but you CAN check out my city layout and see what's happening there. You can structure a response in a way that doesn't make me feel foolish.

Thank you
Heroes forge in a few chapters becomes "obsolete"
1 because by that time the armoury outpace the forge in orc production.
And if you really get the hang of it in the tournaments and get some of the correct wonders up to par you will pretty much stop using heavy melee troops. so that 40% attack bonus becomes obsolete as well.

I think he darefore suggest to swallow the pill now and ignore it, instead put your KP into a better wonder that will support you in the future.
Good battle wonders are:

Needles, monestary/sanctuary , flying academy, shrooms, dragon abbey, temple of the toads, and timewarp (for tournaments), victory springs is an afterthought, it's nice to have (since it boosts training grounds) but those are also the units you'll use the least so not on par with the others.

and yes more armories help with orc production and unit production time, especially combined with shrooms.
 

Gargon667

Mentor
I see that moving forward there is a lot more demand on sentient goods and seeds, less on standard goods... is this an ongoing trend?
The only constant is change. You are in chapter 14 right now. Which means the easy part of the game in terms of chapters (where you can skip chapters by using PPs) is about to be over. The good news is your military is going to get a hell of a lot better soon. You get Blossom 3 stars and 2 of the most important AWs in the game in chapter 14. If I was in your place I would upgrade those 2 AWs any chance you get (they are much more expensive to upgrade than previous AWs). Focus on the FA otherwise as those units are about to go through the roof in chapter 14 and 15 with the 3 star upgrades.

  • lose some of my standard goods buildings to make space/population available to build another armory
  • build more sentient manus... and which? (currently I'm very short of obsidian/ink/velvet... does this change?)
Your need for Sentients will explode next chapter. 15 is by far the biggest need for sentients of any chapter, it will go down again after 15. Chapter 15 will need T6 more than anything else, but you still need silly quantities of T4 and T5 as well. Start building up Sentient and Seed production for the upcoming chapter, if you have a Storm Phoenix it will help, so will the ETC. I was running 8 Sentient factories in that chapter (and a whole field of seed producers, like 15 Festival Merchants and 20 of whatever seed producing building the previous event spit out), fewer will do but prepare for slow going.
Standard goods are no big issue. You need a few for Sentient goods production of course, but nothing major. I don´t quite remember, but I am sure I had not more than 3 (probably less) standard factories (something like 1 T1 and 1 or 2 T3?). I do have Spire libraries for T2 and old Sets/Evolves for additional production though.
  • is my mana production over-kill? Elvengems only advises according to city progress & research, not spire/tourney needs, so its flippen difficult for me to assess my needs... specially when I don't always understand WHAT I'll need in the future.

Mana usually stops being an issue in chapter 13 but picks up again in the currently last chapter from what I have heard (I don´t play it, so don´t take my word for it), but for your foreseeable future there should not be a problem. All you need is a Dragon Abbey.

I also see you have 4 armories in your Winyador city... is this helping?
  • @Gargon667 also mentioned Heros Forge a waste of time, I'm terribly confused by that as currently I'm getting free orcs (which I badly need to produce Orc Warriors & Orc Strategists) and 115% boost to Heavy Melee damage.
Orcs are the second biggest problem in 15 (after sentients). You will need tons of them , like orders of magnitude (not 10s of thousands like previously, but a million or 2) more than in any previous chapter (and that problem will grow even bigger in chapter 16). The Heroes Forge is not going to solve your problem unfortunately. The production will disappear in the rounding error... like a drop of water on a hot stone as we say ;) So you need to find FAR better Orc producers anyway. 3 Options are: More armories (which has the added benefit of bigger training size), Crafting Orc Nests en masse (not nests but dozens of nests) or the occasional event daily prize (like entire event currency of the event spending on that 1 day). If you have the Forge already, keep it, but upgrading it will do nothing to solve your problem. And no, do NOT produce Orc Warrior or Strategists in the Training grounds, you simply do not have the Orcs to spare. Better start saving up right now, too. Orcs do not produce quickly, even if you do all of the above.

  • Elvengems is very detailed about which wonders are for fighting strategy & which catering... but is there a hierarchy between wonders? ie, is it better to have some and not others of same category?
The AW part has already been answered by @CrazyWizard just add the Simia Sapiens to the list :) (I bet he didn´t intentionally skip that one) and I also agree to skip the Vic Springs. Not a horrible one, but also surely not in the top10 of important AWs, focus on those until you have them all well developed (or IMO at lvl 30) before spreading points into "nice" AWs

I do try craft boost buildings, but find I spend most of my catalysts on pet food & supply windfalls to keep up with troop demand. The amount of catalysts I'm actually winning from Spire is negligible. The dwarven armourers I win (maybe), I end up using for next Spire, so I'm not really gaining anything there, am I? I actually do put a hell of a lot of effort into Spire/tourney, which is why I'm exhausted and frustrated. It just seems the effort & resources used in Spire are not worth it... the stuff I win, I just use to battle the rest one... never-ending story.
Don´t try, DO craft every boost building coming through your MA. First thing! Saves you more troops than you can pay for with supply instants and also costs less catalysts than feeding a Firebird through a tourney.
Although apart from that I completely agree with your choice. I also craft every pet food and every big Supply instant (as well as every purple time boost) in my MA
I don´t know what you use your Pet Foods for, but it usually is possible to save up a few more. All you really need to feed is your Firebird 3 times a week (until your get the Timewarp, which reduces the need for Pet Food further) and your brown bear once a month when you use all your time boosts on it. Everything besides that is a luxury (not a bad one don´t get me wrong, but still a luxury)
About catalysts, i think ther are 3 things to increase production outside of making them 24/7 in the MA:
1. Finish the spire every week (small increase, but the goal is to do that anyway, so no real cost there)
2. Place Spire library sets (every library produces 1 CC per day, having 5 of them makes an additional 35 CC per week, you can translate how much that makes you in crafting goods yourself.
3. Improve your FS, Either by actually improving your current FS or by joining a "better" one. team rewards are a HUGE source of CC, if you finish the Spire every week you certainly can play in a FS that gets gold every week :) In EN3 there are currently 8 FS to choose from that get gold regularly or always, and an additional 3-5 that have managed at least once and are therefore only a few good towns away from getting there regularly.
Those are the aforementioned positive feedback loops. The more you do the more you get back and the easier it becomes to do more again. These loops only get stopped by the tourneys drastic increase in costs in higher provinces.

The dwarven armourers I win (maybe), I end up using for next Spire, so I'm not really gaining anything there, am I? I actually do put a hell of a lot of effort into Spire/tourney, which is why I'm exhausted and frustrated. It just seems the effort & resources used in Spire are not worth it... the stuff I win, I just use to battle the rest one... never-ending story.
Yes do DO win! If you get an armorer and use it next week you DO gain because your next spire and tourney will be that much easier, you gain everything that you would otherwise have to spend to achieve the same result without the armorer.
It sure is a never ending story, that´s the whole point of it. We´re spinning a wheel, we just spin it faster and faster, but all it does is go round and round lol But the point is the faster you spin it the more goodies fall off it.
I guess the big question is: what do you want out of the game? Which part is the one you enjoy? Focus on that one and leave the other parts to those that enjoy them. There is no law that says you have to play a certain way.
 

Gargon667

Mentor
Part 2 lol (over the 10k limit)

I'm totally open to constructive and helpful criticism, I just get hella frustrated when everyone tells me this should be easy... like I'm sort of idiot for not realising this.

I understand that players can't see into my gameplay to assess that, but you CAN check out my city layout and see what's happening there. You can structure a response in a way that doesn't make me feel foolish.
This is the most difficult to answer ;)
I sure do not mean any offense at all, but my wife keeps telling me I am emotionally disabled and she usually is right about such things...

The problem here is: As long as you play the spire while USING up resources, it is more or less an impossible task, as soon as you start playing the spire GAINING resources it does become the simplest thing in the world (it pays for itself plus some). 95% of people (probably more) are in the first group. A bunch of folks hanging around here on the forum are in the second. We can´t say much besides how simple it is, because it is! I do appreciate the fact that it is not easy to get there though, there are various way to get there and all we can do is point that out. If you do figure out how it works you´ll soon be saying the same, if you don´t you won´t.

I hope you don´t feel foolish now, I just try and point out as many facts as possible. however I pretty much bet you will feel foolish for not figuring out sooner the moment it starts working for you. I sure do lol, and I guess so does everybody else in that first group, at least I don´t know anyone who has finished the spire every single week since it started on beta a year and a half ago... I still laugh about myself for missing out on at least 3 or 4 lvl 3 bosses in the first few month after it went live. I somehow thought it wasn´t worth it lol, well in my defense back then there were no team rewards but still... I would not skip those today if given the chance again....

That got quite a bit longer than planned lol, anyway happy gaming :D