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Discussion News from Beta (may contain spoilers!)

Killiak

Summoner
The strange thing is that they've introduced chests 11-19. Opening all those would need 161k tournament points so they must be allowing for the fact that people should be able to push further at some point.
Adding in chests 11-19, but also nerfing the heck out of what people can do. It doesn't even make sense, it's complete and utter insanity.

I don't have any kind words whatsoever for this. Total d***-move.
 

valle

Spellcaster
You who thinks that expansions will make it harder, are you sure? Think about all you gain from your expansions or do you really think you would do better if you could remove all your premium expansions. I doubt it. all those expansion will make it possible for you to build things that will make progress in tournament easier. The fighting will get harder, but you could probably cater more provinces.
The big question is wiill the net effect of premium expansions be positive or negative? You seem to be sure it will be negative, I'm not sure and I would gladly take a free premium axpansion if I got it.

And about AWs. If an AW is so bad that you don't want it since it makes fighting a bit harder, then it prbably shouldn't be there in the first place. I've sold AWs in the past when I found out they were no good and see no problems doing it again if I consider them not worth there space. As with expansion I think a lot of AWs will still be useful and do more good than bad. It's just a part of the challenge with this game, you will have to be able to adapt to a changing environment.
 

valle

Spellcaster
Adding in chests 11-19, but also nerfing the heck out of what people can do. It doesn't even make sense, it's complete and utter insanity.

I don't have any kind words whatsoever for this. Total d***-move.
Whats wrong with a goal. Even if you can't do all chests now, maybe in the future. When tournament started a lot of people also thought the last chest was 'impossible' to get. People adapt and will probably figure out ways to do it.
 

Hekata

Illusionist
ertainly there could be a compromise here and if they found a way to take expansions and AWs out of the equation so that people could go further again, whilst also taking away some of the KP prizes from the rewards then I would welcome that.
Ofc there is a way. Players have suggested quite a few :)
 

Hekata

Illusionist
Here's what Marindor just said on Beta just now about more changes being made:

"And as always, these are the moments when you actually get some new things to share. Over the next couple of weeks, we will focus on these things:

  • Decreasing the chance for mana and orcs to appear in negotiation, plus slightly decreasing the chance of coins and supplies to appear here.
  • Reducing the impact expansions (both premium and regular) have on difficulty for both Tournaments and Spire. Because they also affect the Spire difficulty, these changes will probably be merged to Live sooner than the new tournaments (since we still need testing time for those).
  • Seperating the unit production queues so multiple unit training buildings can work simultaneously. This will probably take a bit more time than the rest.
We have no exact dates yet for the implementations, but at least you know what our next topics are, aside from the whole general balancing issue which keeps being investigated. As always, please keep sharing your feedback, because as you can see that does help us make changes in certain directions. "

So some good news about expansions, but nothing about Aws yet. Too bad because I was much less worried about expansions. Building the city within confined space has always been the most interesting challenge of this game for me and I'm ok it stays that way. I hope the part about looking into balancing issues does include AWs.
 

buvau

Spellcaster
I think that the best way forward would be to set difficulty depending on the chapter. Actually few levels of difficulty per chapter. So when player is progressing through tech tree, difficulty is gradually increasing. This would be FAIR option taking into consideration every player (all groups should be considered, some go for ranking, others play only occasionally - for me Elvenar is type of casual game).

AWs must be left out completely, they are slow and difficult to evolve, provide varying benefits depending on the chapter and players strategy. AWs should be in the same category as expiring military boosts. Like majority of players, I do not see myself playing any game for four or more years in a row. Almost a year here, already bored and often contemplating about doing something else :) Little push would be enough.

Expansions.. well limited space is stupidity in my eyes, I do not like it in any shape or form, hence I was always working towards more expansions, including premium. Some weight might be given to them, but I already noticed Inno's lack of sensible and proportionate decisions - have no trust that it will be addressed in a sensible manner.

Tournaments are challenging enough in their current form already. If player does not have temporary military boosts and fire phoenix they will not go very far. Same applies to catering. I think lessons have not been learnt from the spire (hard data is available) - this feature became dividing factor, often done at high cost with very little benefit (outcome similar to random player coming and looting your resources on weekly basis). Actually, I think that spire is to blame why players are leaving now at higher rates. Why to introduce another feature with yet another option to put pressure on fellows in the FS (I mean, harder tournaments and more chests)?

I personally would like to see more features facilitating individual game and less reliance on FS. tbh, the latest mess means that as an individual player I will not be able to find FS soon which would be worth my effort, i.e. too many conflicting preferences. Simply put - complete mess.
 

Pauly7

Mentor
So some good news about expansions, but nothing about Aws yet. Too bad because I was much less worried about expansions. Building the city within confined space has always been the most interesting challenge of this game for me and I'm ok it stays that way. I hope the part about looking into balancing issues does include AWs.
With my hat of positivity on, if they are working on both AWs and expansions it does not surprise me that the update to expansions is coming first. They may want to do them separately to test the effect and they may be looking at a much more complex equation for AWs. If they are doing as has been suggested then they could be trying to make different impacts from different Wonders.
 

Pauly7

Mentor
Ofc there is a way. Players have suggested quite a few :)
What I meant was, if I was looking at it from their perspective and not wishing to ditch the new system they've created then they could be thinking about changing the rules for expansions and AWs whilst still keeping it more difficult to progress than in the old system, so that we have an increase in difficulty without punishing the experienced players. You're right, lots of ways have been suggested, but a way needs to be found that they're on board with too.

Still, we'll have something new to look at tonight so that has to be at least a little encouraging.
 

Stricko

Novice
I'm the archmage of the full FS. We are all at 6the stage, I'm on 7th. We all spent some money for expansions. We will never do it again, even with 10000% more diamonds. I hope the money income will go to zero very soon. Maybe then they will realise what are they doing.
 

Hekata

Illusionist
What I meant was, if I was looking at it from their perspective and not wishing to ditch the new system they've created then they could be thinking about changing the rules for expansions and AWs whilst still keeping it more difficult to progress than in the old system, so that we have an increase in difficulty without punishing the experienced players. You're right, lots of ways have been suggested, but a way needs to be found that they're on board with too.

Still, we'll have something new to look at tonight so that has to be at least a little encouraging.
Well even within the new system, I seem to recall at lest one player giving a very concrete suggestion to lower a couple of numbers (sorry, you know I suck at maths and stats so can't remember what it was :) ) which would allow the tournament to be harder but don't go up so exponentially. Who knows, maybe they did take that suggestion and are looking into it without announcing it yet. To be honest I was positively surprised to see the changes they have announced today, so maybe in the end it doesn't turn out to be as bad as I thought. I'm just a little bit optimistic now, like 5-7% :D
 

CrazyWizard

Scholar
Off course those that do 200-2000 points a week are happy with this change, they thought tournaments where a drag, it's get easier for them, they will do 600-2500 for 2 weeks then go back to 200-2000 and still think tournaments are a drag.

Those more activetourment players are dong a lot more, to a certain extend it's a drag as well, but for them the rewards are more important, and they are willing to spend money on it (you do not want to know how many of them spend money last easter to complete the Fire feniks on the new world that did not have the old easter event)
They spend money on a bigger town (premium expansions) they invest as much as they can in (military) wonders, they top the leaderboards (many magic residences / workshops) and get many kp for there wonders, and for a while this will workt totally fine under this new "
Here's what Marindor just said on Beta just now about more changes being made:

"And as always, these are the moments when you actually get some new things to share. Over the next couple of weeks, we will focus on these things:

  • Decreasing the chance for mana and orcs to appear in negotiation, plus slightly decreasing the chance of coins and supplies to appear here.
  • Reducing the impact expansions (both premium and regular) have on difficulty for both Tournaments and Spire. Because they also affect the Spire difficulty, these changes will probably be merged to Live sooner than the new tournaments (since we still need testing time for those).
  • Seperating the unit production queues so multiple unit training buildings can work simultaneously. This will probably take a bit more time than the rest.
We have no exact dates yet for the implementations, but at least you know what our next topics are, aside from the whole general balancing issue which keeps being investigated. As always, please keep sharing your feedback, because as you can see that does help us make changes in certain directions. "

So some good news about expansions, but nothing about Aws yet. Too bad because I was much less worried about expansions. Building the city within confined space has always been the most interesting challenge of this game for me and I'm ok it stays that way. I hope the part about looking into balancing issues does include AWs.
Looks like the cosmetic change thing is starting, but no actions to the underlying issue.
You could change the "impact" of expansions but it means the formula will stay.
 

Pauly7

Mentor
It all could be a bit messy because players and devs are focussing on the new tournaments. There's now going to be a whole extra layer of people "discussing" whether the FA should be rebalanced because it will be harder to make some of the badges.... It looks like it's another Type E adventure - so the hardest one.
 

Julian

Scholar
Of course, the FA may come before the changes to the tournament. Events and FAs are generally 2 weeks behind Beta. But the spire came to Beta months before it went live. So, there's no telling how long the tournament changes will take.
 

JackLuyt

Illusionist
A New Fellowship Adventures has started Friday 7th.
It should go Live soon after the current event is over.

It appears to be the same type E2 (16 Item) version that we had in April - we still have to verify Stages 2 and 3, and the Pit.

Read more here):
https://tinyurl.com/yyegsm4r

Update: There are minor changes in the waypoints - the previous version Blue Path had 20 Flacons (now 26) and 13 Elvarian Guard (now 9). I am busy correcting the graphics

In Thursday's Beta upgrade. there have been changes to the cost of Technologies in Chapter XIV:
Dear Humans and Elves,
We have reduced the costs of technologies early in the Constructs chapter to make the transition from Chapter 14 to Chapter 15 less steep.




The Stage Prizes
Ancient Knowledge Instants, 20 hour Booster, Carting Library and 2 Wise Golem Artifacts.
:)




The Fellowship Rewards are identical to last time.
 
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JackLuyt

Illusionist
The Stage Prizes

So far it looks like an E2 type, same as in April
More details to follow

Ancient Knowledge Instants, 20 hour Booster, Carting Library and 2 Wise Golem Artifacts.
:)