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New units and tournament bugged?

DeletedUser8409

Guest
There has been a significant change in the last 2 tourneys - they have been considerably more difficult than the same 2 tourneys in the last cycle. This change coincides with the introduction of the latest chapter - perhaps key, perhaps not.

That we should now be disconnecting AWs, not feeding Fire Phoenix and not deploying troop buffs in a effort to minimize the impact of this issue, is absurd but it's all we have.

I don't think many of us will enjoy continuing this nonsense for any length of time without some high profile intervention from Immo.
If you're not feeding your Fire Phoenix then the tournament will be harder lol. That's bad advice if someone has given it I've used mine this week no issues.

Yes Crystal and Scrolls were harder with the new troops and they helped flag the long existing it seems bug but Silk was no harder. I got thousands more points this Silk week than last time.
 

OldHag

Scholar
If you're not feeding your Fire Phoenix then the tournament will be harder lol. That's bad advice if someone has given it I've used mine this week no issues.

Yes Crystal and Scrolls were harder with the new troops and they helped flag the long existing it seems bug but Silk was no harder. I got thousands more points this Silk week than last time.

if you read back through the thread, there are quite a few suggestions as to what might be causing this bug and how to work around it, including not feeding fire pheonix, disconnecting certain buildings, etc. etc.
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This is now the end of the 3rd week since the introduction of the new chapter and this bug appeared.

That's the only thing that changed and a pretty big clue for the devs.

It's shameful that they haven't updated players on progress.
 

DeletedUser8409

Guest
if you read back through the thread, there are quite a few suggestions as to what might be causing this bug and how to work around it, including not feeding fire pheonix, disconnecting certain buildings, etc. etc.
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This is now the end of the 3rd week since the introduction of the new chapter and this bug appeared.

That's the only thing that changed and a pretty big clue for the devs.

It's shameful that they haven't updated players on progress.
I have read the thread and seen some suggest not feeding phoenix and others point out that is a bad idea. Just because someone suggests a bad idea doesn't make it right!

The bug seems to have been identified that attack boosters [like Fire Phoenix] are boosting 'shared' units. In Crystal that was Frogs [new and upgraded], in Scrolls it was Rangers [new and upgraded] and in Silk it was Cerberus [same as its long been]. If you fed your Fire Phoenix you boost all your squads and just one of your opponents - it boosts you more than the enemy by definition. Next week the Drone Riders are the shared unit but since they're pretty crappy I wouldn't worry too much about that.

This is the end of the 1st week since the bug was identified. Crystal the bug wasn't identified, Scrolls the bug was identified and confirmed over the weekend, Silk we got an update when the work week started saying they'd identified the bug and are working on it.

What progress beyond that should they update us with? Its a confirmed bug and they're working on it - when there's a solution it will be rolled out, until then it is a confirmed bug.

PS lets not forget that the new chapter was rolled out to Beta previously and this bug was not identified on Beta. Probably because it wasn't a new bug and it was the new units that led people to look into what was going on and they weren't played in Beta since the chapter wasn't released 9 weeks ago there.
 

Timneh

Artisan
Some poeple are saying this bug has always been there and some are saying it is new, these are just opinions of those people and the only ones that can know for sure are the devs and it's debateable as to if they even know at this time.
 

DeletedUser8632

Guest
Why the relative silence on the part of the developers? I realize that we cannot expect any compensation in terms of lost troops or goods secondary to Inno's bug since we had to agree to waive this option just to play the game, but why not tell us exactly what is going on and keep us posted about the expected fix date.

@Susananna , it's clear that they treat us as second class citizens. They rarely, if ever, grace with their presence when very serious issues are brought to their attention and they're mentioned

I absolutely agree emotionally but here is something else I read in the German forum: There are policies in places (which we all agreed to when we ticked that checkbox about ... all those things we never really read) that explicitly states that: Inno forum staff will not discuss technical or gameplay issues. Inno staff will not announce bugs or technical issues in the forum. Its very likely that @Muf-Muf and Tacheless have already scraped the boundary of what they are allowed to communicate.

My problem is now: I want to shout at Inno for their utter disregard for their player-base but at the same time I don't want to get another mod into hot water.
 

DeletedUser1874

Guest
I absolutely agree emotionally but here is something else I read in the German forum: There are policies in places (which we all agreed to when we ticked that checkbox about ... all those things we never really read) that explicitly states that: Inno forum staff will not discuss technical or gameplay issues. Inno staff will not announce bugs or technical issues in the forum. Its very likely that @Muf-Muf and Tacheless have already scraped the boundary of what they are allowed to communicate.

My problem is now: I want to shout at Inno for their utter disregard for their player-base but at the same time I don't want to get another mod into hot water.
Those "policies" are garbage with the legal weight of one ply cheap toilet paper designed to provide plausible deniability and convenient excuses for companies. Not my words, mind you, I'm just a chemist - however between my work with the EPO (and USPTO, and JPO) and my most underpaid and unpleasant yet necessary experiences as Court Appointed Expert Witness, my friends-and-acquaintances pool is comprised for the most part of lawyers and judges - it was one of them, in fact - a fellow gamer -, who came up with that rather colourful yet effective definition for that kind of EULAs and TOSs. There's an even more colourful popular in-joke about the latter acronym, but I'm not going to mention it here, although it'd likely amuse the British audience.
 

OldHag

Scholar
I have read the thread and seen some suggest not feeding phoenix and others point out that is a bad idea. Just because someone suggests a bad idea doesn't make it right!
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My point was that we are having to rely on players who post on the forums for info as to what's happening about this, whether their advice/suggestion are good or bad is irrelevant, it's the only advice we have to go on.
Last weeks tourney I didn't feed my pet on the Tuesday for the start of the tourney, but one of my fs mates told me that it was ok to feed it last week, so I did feed on the Wednesday. This coming week, I don't know if it's ok to feed or not, as I have no idea what to expect by way of new troops that maybe effected. No point in asking Inno about it, so I'm kinda relying on forums and fs mates.
Maybe I'm too fussy and expecting too much from Inno.
 

Heymrdiedier

Enchanter
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My point was that we are having to rely on players who post on the forums for info as to what's happening about this, whether their advice/suggestion are good or bad is irrelevant, it's the only advice we have to go on.
Last weeks tourney I didn't feed my pet on the Tuesday for the start of the tourney, but one of my fs mates told me that it was ok to feed it last week, so I did feed on the Wednesday. This coming week, I don't know if it's ok to feed or not, as I have no idea what to expect by way of new troops that maybe effected. No point in asking Inno about it, so I'm kinda relying on forums and fs mates.
Maybe I'm too fussy and expecting too much from Inno.

as long as you pick the right units, you should have an advantage over the enemy (more damage) So using the phoenix means you would get more extra damage then the enemy does. So it does not make sense to not use pet food on the phoenix, unless if you are very low on petfood and would rather use it when the bug is fixed and you have more benefit from it.
 

MinMax Gamer

Illusionist
as long as you pick the right units, you should have an advantage over the enemy (more damage) So using the phoenix means you would get more extra damage then the enemy does.
This is not accurate in many cases. You assume that damage delivery is instantaneous on both sides - it is not. With initiative and range differences the effect can be quite different. So your light melee technically has the advantage over enemy's light range units. Let's do a thought experiment, and increase damage on both sides 100x. Do you think you will still be better off? Light range has the highest initiative and range, so they one-shot your troops. The fact that your troops also had enormous damage potential is irrelevant as they're all dead.

If you think this is a hypothetical scenario, this is pretty much how the bug was confirmed on DE servers - someone put up 4x ELR + Fire Phoenix, and 3* enemy rangers one-shot killed all the troops.
 

Heymrdiedier

Enchanter
I think the speculation about the actual extent is spot on. I fought my smallest city, that has no troop boosting Wonders, or Fire Phoenix, and man the enemy dogs are vicious.
i agree, i also had trouble on a new world. But ofcourse it doesnt help if the enemy dogs are 2 or 3 stars and my treants are still 1 star. And ofcourse then you still have to take the overpowered enchantress into account (who negates all the defense bonusses for all units)

This is not accurate in many cases. You assume that damage delivery is instantaneous on both sides - it is not. With initiative and range differences the effect can be quite different. So your light melee technically has the advantage over enemy's light range units. Let's do a thought experiment, and increase damage on both sides 100x. Do you think you will still be better off? Light range has the highest initiative and range, so they one-shot your troops. The fact that your troops also had enormous damage potential is irrelevant as they're all dead.

If you think this is a hypothetical scenario, this is pretty much how the bug was confirmed on DE servers - someone put up 4x ELR + Fire Phoenix, and 3* enemy rangers one-shot killed all the troops.

well there you point out a flaw in innos design, light melee is the most underpowered class of units of all. They should win agains bows and mages theoritically, but they dont do so well in practice. In fights with more then 2 light ranged, almost always the orc strategist is the right unit to choose. unless theres also many mages, then bows (rangers) are the right units to choose.
That flaw is also the reason why everyone hates scrolls tournament, in theory light melee is the best unit, in practice they suck
 
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DeletedUser8409

Guest
This is not accurate in many cases. You assume that damage delivery is instantaneous on both sides - it is not. With initiative and range differences the effect can be quite different. So your light melee technically has the advantage over enemy's light range units. Let's do a thought experiment, and increase damage on both sides 100x. Do you think you will still be better off? Light range has the highest initiative and range, so they one-shot your troops. The fact that your troops also had enormous damage potential is irrelevant as they're all dead.

If you think this is a hypothetical scenario, this is pretty much how the bug was confirmed on DE servers - someone put up 4x ELR + Fire Phoenix, and 3* enemy rangers one-shot killed all the troops.
Yes but ELRs boost Rangers and not LM. In your example where you are using LMs against LR why would you put in ELRs?
 

Gargon667

Mentor
Please Devs, do NOT come here or any other of the 137 Forums elvenar has, just to please some people that will never be pleased. That would be wasting your time. Instead go ad do the job in your job description and do some coding and ignore all the noise!

And while we are at it all you people with demands to get answers. Go and read the forums first. Yes the Forum mods (it is actually those peoples job to talk to us, not the devs) are being quiet, simply because there is nothing new to say. All the important info is out there: The bug is known and confirmed. They have also already acknowledged that they 1. are working on it and 2. do not know what the problem is, which is also answering your next question: when will it be fixed: Some time after they figure out what the problem is.

Btw I want to see all you guys sit in your office answering your phones (or whatever it is you do for a living) on a public holiday, before you complain about other people taking their time off. And if they decide to go on a 1month holiday so be it. This is a game and if a little bug makes it impossible for you to play, you need to brush up on your skills. Yes it is annoying, it annoys me, too but that´s as far as it goes. Nothing to get upset about. Just another challenge, although unintended ...

Now upcoming tourney it won´t matter much if the bug persists, it will only affect one of the worst units in the game, if you can´t deal with stronger Drone Riders than usual, there is really not much left to say... maybe you better make good on your threats and quit the game already and leave it to people that enjoy playing, instead of throwing another temper tantrum.

Rant over. Have fun day elvenaring :D
 

DeletedUser8409

Guest
If there's a fix now on Beta @Muf-Muf how quickly can it be rolled out to Live? Any chance of getting it to Live before Tournament starts?
 

Cerebros

Conjurer
From Beta moderator, kersepitje:

I can't tell you what went wrong, but i know how they fixed it now. They added a flag to all units indicating if its an enemy unit or not, and all buffs cannot affect enemy units anymore.
I know you wanna know if this bug was always there or introduced recently with the Elvenar chapter but i can not answer that. At the moment only the developer(s) who fixed the bug know that answer, i will try to see if i can find out more.
For now, lets assume the bug was always there, so that we can hope that all fights will be a bit easier now :)


So it's fixed :)
 

Heymrdiedier

Enchanter
From Beta moderator, kersepitje:

I can't tell you what went wrong, but i know how they fixed it now. They added a flag to all units indicating if its an enemy unit or not, and all buffs cannot affect enemy units anymore.
I know you wanna know if this bug was always there or introduced recently with the Elvenar chapter but i can not answer that. At the moment only the developer(s) who fixed the bug know that answer, i will try to see if i can find out more.
For now, lets assume the bug was always there, so that we can hope that all fights will be a bit easier now :)


So it's fixed :)
now the question is, is this allready on live aswell or not? we got an update today, was it for this fix or for something else?
 
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