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Mages and Arch-mages, if you can tick 10 out of 10 from this list, your FS is well on the way to the top 10.

1. Full-house full-time (25/25) more hands make work lighter, some FS even replace less active with more active players.
2. 250K plus median user score:: 250K is the median score of each fellow, minimum entry level from 100K is common
3. Chapter.10 upward: the lowest one I see is chap.9. the more advanced fellows are, the more they contribute

4. Help and Trade:Members expelled for inactive neighbor help. most FS have strict rules on Trade, esp. cross-trade
5. Distinct Mage's Role: Mages do have tasks assigned, and have a say in recruitment process.
6. 10-Chest in Tournament: 10-chest/week 52week/year. Minimum score required of fellow per tournament is the norm.

7. Wonder Builder: active KP thread/swap. Left-over free prizes from Wonder Upgrade are shouted by owners, and picked up by
fellows. Median Wonder Level per member is normally 90 upwards
8. Avid user of Boosters: Wishing Wells, Carting Libary, Trading Posts are over-used by Fellows

9. Perks: in-house trivia games rewarded with KP prizes, like quiz or so
10. Communication: the Public Chat is like a flea market, with anything from wonder upgrade reminder to fellow ranting.


The majority of those points are just things associated with any active fellowship.

Some of them seem a bit odd such as "250k median. 100k minimum". If the topic is being "on the way" to top 10 then minimums and medians could be anything along the way.

There are also a couple that are just subjective and don't apply to all top fellowships such as trading rules and one particular style of KP swapping.

Other than that, yep some valid points there. :)
Mathematically, minimum means the lowest point. Median means the totally average of all fellows in a FS.
250K median does not mean everyone in that FS has 250K. They may have fellows of more than 250K, and thus compensate for fellows of 100K.

MinMax Gamer

Median means the totally average of all fellows in a FS.
Well, as you mentioned mathematically, then this is not what median means. The average score of all fellows in the FS that you're describing is the mean; median for the 25-member FS would simply be the score of their 13th ranked member (12 are above such fellow, and 12 are below).

These could be significantly different. For the hypothetical FS with 12 members with 1mm score and 13 members with 10K score the mean would be slightly less than 500K, but median would be 10K.


I'm familiar with the words and also guessed what you meant. What I was saying is that you could be a small fellowship with an average score of 10k and still be "on the way to the top 10". Everyone starts somewhere.


I played for nearly 2 years under a different name and I found that very often the advanced fellows contributed very little and less advanced players contributed substantially, especially in tournaments! :p
This ^^

Also, what exactly is a 'top 10' FS? Ranking points aren't everything and in some cases are little more than a measure of how much money has been spent. If I was looking for a 'real' Top 10 FS I'd be far more interested in the interaction between the FS players and whether they were active or not, the lack of drama and histrionics which seem to blight some FS and whether the FS was made up of team players rather than 25 people solely concerned with their own cities and doing their own thing. A well developed sense of humour within the FS would also by on my tick-list. Others may have a different view of course.
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Agreed @EdwardTrunk. A "top 10 fellowship" could easily have a bunch of inactive players, or people not contributing in tournaments. Quality of fellowship to meet your own needs is more important.

Agreed @PeaceLillies also. If they are tiny tiny they may struggle, but often the 50k players are churning out more consistent tournament points than the much bigger ones.


It is useful to know what the OP thinks a top 10 fellowship looks like, should I ever think about joining a fellowship of which he is a part.
Firstly of all, thank you to those who have read (and replied to) my first post "10 Traits of top 10 FS"
Quite a few viewers have mistaken that the top FS also gotta be the BEST FS.
Shall I make it clear "the BEST FS is not necessary the TOP FS" and "the TOP FS is not always the BEST FS" for you.

Many players come to this game as a past-time, an escape, a chill out from life. As such, you're wasting your time here. Go and find a better way to waste your time.

This game is more like a job, a class. If you don't log-on timely to collect your production or to engage in tournaments, you'd miss out and fall behind your peers. You may even be kicked out of your FS, should you not be active enough. Pretty much the same way you'd be kicked out of school/uni should your attendance is poor, or lose your job should your performance fails below expectations.

A FS is like a company with rules and expectation with constant performance review. No cross-trading, minimum 2-star trade, minimum score in Tournament, neighbor help, and so on seems pretty common at the surface with all FS.

Deep down, each and every FS has its own CULTURE and IDIOSYNCRASY that would either fit or clash with your personality. Most people stay longer or settle down permanently with a FS that they would feel comfortable with, and their cities grow fatter and fatter overtime, OBESITY.

For me, as an ELF, I do the opposite. I would leave a FS whenever I start to get comfy there. Whenever I leave or join a FS, I always learn something new, and UNLEARN something OLD. From little to big things, there is always compromise, and changes required. There is always decision to make, 'should I jump ship now?' or 'wait to walk the plank?'

The BEST FS for me is the one taking me out of my comfort zone. Once I move out of my comfort zone, it would only grow bigger.

The best FS is therefore the one making the best out of you, not the FATTEST out of you.

Over to you, when is the last time, you UNLEARN something OLD?

Karl Hungus

Let me start by saying that Bob is a great asset to any fellowship. You may disagree with his views but it's highly doubtful you would object to his presence in your fellowship even if he's not there for very long. He pulls his weight, is active as a player (in terms of both participation and sociability) and follows fellowship rules and guidelines. He is also considerate in both his public and private communications. He doesn't create or respond to drama in spite of his seriousness as a player.

As for treating the game like a job, I must admit I agree with Bob. I wish people who had less of a commitment would leave the game. If factors which distract ones dedication to the game intervene, such as work, family or health issues, then an understanding fellowship should be willing to offer latitude but it is the responsibility of the player to communicate his or her needs. Note also that it's possible to enjoy a job as much as a game or other pastime so those arguments about taking a game too seriously are ultimately pretty hollow. One can view a game as a job and still enjoy it.

Lastly, although I don't agree with Bob's views about getting too comfortable in a fellowship, I can see his point. If moving around is what keeps Bob happy and interested in the game, then that's what he should be doing. As for getting fatter or too complacent in one place, I find that the issue is largely resolved by fellowship turnover. People are always leaving, getting kicked out of or joining fellowships. For me, the departure/addition of new players address many of the issues Bob raises. Players make and thereby change fellowships, for better or worse. Others can either inspire or discourage you. Everyone has something to teach just as we always have something new to learn.

Again, I'm very grateful Bob was with us for the time he was and wish him the best where ever he ends up.


I have no doubt that Bob is a great asset. And you are right, people can play as seriously as they want. My issue is with what he said (and you too) that people who are not as serious should leave the game. And in general telling people how to play the game. I believe in a "play and let play" principal that should apply to all. There are different kind of players and different kind of fellowships. Everyone can find their place. Being a serious player doesn't give you the right to tell people how to play. All you can do is pick who you want in your FS and kick out the ones that don't fit in.


I agree with @Hekata , it has nothing to do with anyone else how i play my game just like it is nothing to do with me how they play the way they do. What i object to is someone coming on a forum and telling other players how they should play and that if they are not serious about the game they should leave. Maybe Bob should leave the game if he is so unhappy about players not being as serious as he thinks they should be.


You may disagree with his views but it's highly doubtful you would object to his presence in your fellowship even if he's not there for very long.
I guess we all have different views on things. Speaking as an archmage I would have no interest whatsoever in having a player join who was intending to bounce from FS to FS every couple of weeks. Of course, he's entitled to do that if that's his thing and other FS are happy to put up with it. I just wouldn't be interested in such a player and neither would the rest of my FS.

As for treating the game like a job, I must admit I agree with Bob. I wish people who had less of a commitment would leave the game.
I couldn't disagree more. Life is full of enough difficulties, stress and commitments for many of us. The very last thing I want is to add another one in the form of a game. That doesn't mean, of course, not investing enough time to make a contribution... but treating it as a job.... absolutely not!

And lastly, I'd echo what both Hekata and timneh have said... let people play the way they want to, I really don't need someone else telling me how I should be playing. :mad:
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Why get upset? What Bob says is his view, which I find thought-provoking and I like anything that gets me thinking even not necessarily agreeing. For me, the best fellowship is one where I feel at home, where everybody pulls their weight according to their capacity, where knowledge points aren't counted like diamonds, but also freely given just to help each other out (which doesn't stop one from do all the happy swapping stuff), where trading is fair and not based on profit-thinking. A place to spend a good time and relax, to have a common battle cry when it goes to tourney, to share the tales of your victories (I swear I'll never eat another mushroom in my whole life!) and defeats (darn I accidentally deleted my firebird and Inno won't give it back - seriously?? who would intentionally delete their maximum evolved firebird??!). So there's my ideal fellowship rap ;)


Having a view on things is fine, trying to force them on others and telling them how they should act and play the game is not fine.
Bouncing from FS to FS is fine for the player doing the bouncing but it might not be OK for the other members of the FS. A player recently joined our FS because they wanted to see what it was like to do 10 chests in a tournament. When that player left after the tournament ended some of the other members felt that the player had used our FS for their own gain and then went back to wherever they came from.