hawk the slayer
Spellcaster
During the last FA I seem to remember being able to see who's participated, I cant seem to find it this time, am I missing something??
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F A participants
- Thread starter hawk the slayer
- Start date
hawk the slayer
Spellcaster
AH!!! Bless ya, I couldn't remember for the life of me and nor could the rest of the FS. Thats great, it was soooo useful and I was afraid it wasn't there 
schadenfreude
Enchanter
They put it in a horrible place. We spent years telling our players to stay away from the dang flag to avoid mis-pulls. Now they have to click on it...
I'll feed that back @schadenfreude but I know a lot of Fellowship Archmages demote their Players temporarily to Fellows so there are no little mis-clicks
CrazyWizard
Shaman
that should also be a hint to create a toggle that say's only mages/archmages.I'll feed that back @schadenfreude but I know a lot of Fellowship Archmages demote their Players temporarily to Fellows so there are no little mis-clicks
they have restricted perkapplication to mages/archmages where I would love to see ambassadors to also be able to add perkpoints to for example the tournament/spire. as there is little to no harm there (using the archive perks)
But in an FA, we have to demote players to avoid mistakes, this is a place where people CAN screw up.
I cannot create more mages, every 1-2 years there is discord between 2 members. if they are mages they can kick eachother or if you have a nutcase enter your fellowship he could kick everyone but the archmage(we had to kick a nutcase with a way to short fuse twice in 7 years). even if there is no discord by accident testing there powers they could do that. with the FA/spire/Tourney lockout for an event/week those accidents can lead to massive repercussions for the victim.
But in an FA an ambassador could destroy the FA by not understanding (thinking the spize is his that he seeks not everyones)
so it's a bit backwards now, where people can do harm we need to demote them to avoid problems, but where people can't do harm we need to promote them to a spot where they can do harm.
Laurelin
Sorcerer
So very much - THIS! - is badly needed - not only in the FA interface, but elsewhere in the game, too, with the ability to enable or disable the feature, at the option of the AM/group leader, being a very important aspect - not everyone runs their group in the same way, after all, and more choice is always better, in any game. If I could upvote @CrazyWizard's post (all of it) multiple times, I would.
That's because the level of admin control described is necessary for [insofar as it's ever possible!] the smooth, easy, and trouble-free running of group activities in ANY online game group, and while the idea below is, at present, the ONLY practical solution to the current lack of proper tools:
... it's also very likely that demoting players who are naturally pretty proud of having been promoted in the first place will, as a result, cause at least some degree of 'resigned resentment', if you like [from trivial to major] - whether or not those players will admit it, as most do not.
I must be honest here, too, and say that a premature 'Flag pull' is far less a 'little misclick' than it is, at the very least, a significant nuisance to at least SOME players involved, all the way up to what amounts to a disaster which can heavily disrupt plans and cause real anger and frustration, especially where the FS is pursuing an organised and/or competitive FA attempt, with all the very laborious planning and supervision required.
And of course none of that is conducive to fostering good 'team spirit' and engagement (which we are so often told is largely the purpose of FAs)! All so readily avoided simply by allowing AMs to choose whether or not Mages/Ambassadors/anyone else can 'pull the Flag'... it's just so simple.
For info, I'm speaking here from knowledge, since I myself once set up and ran a player group in another game, until it became SO much work, in the end, that I entirely stopped progressing in the game myself, and had to 'offline' the group due to burn-out. However, it ran for some two years and, to give myself credit, it was quite highly regarded on its Server, by which point it had ~600 members, with ~50 online at any given time - plus a group Forum, too, which I also set up and then ran by myself. Not boasting; just providing credentials to back myself up.
Furthermore, that game is an MMORPG, so it was very different from Elvenar in many ways, but especially in terms of running its game groups (funnily enough, also called Fellowships!)... it was a much more intensive task than it is in Elvenar, since the group founder/leader and their assisting senior/junior admins (a.k.a. AM and Mages/Ambassadors, here) not only had to deal with pretty much the same tasks which AMs and Mages/Ambassadors undertake in Elvenar, but also actively engaged in live gameplay alongside the group members, as well as operating live group chats as well... so long story short, I can absolutely attest to the fact that the ADDED pressure of inadequate admin tools, as in this game - on top of the well-known stresses (and rewards!) of trying to keep ANY group of people happy at least most of the time - really doesn't help...!
I would never want to run (or even be an admin in) ANY game group again, precisely because it IS so much work, even in a game with advanced group admin controls - and the fact that this can hardly be said of Elvenar, sadly, isn't helping the chances of any AM or Mage who tries to run an Elvenar Fellowship - which, in turn, isn't likely to lead to strong, enduring groups forming... and such groups are the heart and soul of ANY online multiplayer game which relies as heavily as Elvenar does upon inter-player activities to keep the game alive and/or prospering.
Improving the group admin controls should be a major priority for Inno - who are keen enough to add new multiplayer features which require admin, but seem ever-less willing to provide the necessary (and they are) admin controls to allow those features to be USED effectively... FAs are the obvious example, but Perks is another; few even understand how that works, let alone how best to manage it, which seems very odd, to me.
Elvenar has some very complex group mechanics which AMs and Mages, in particular, have to oversee and - somehow! - keep under control in an efficient manner, while simultaneously trying to keep everyone in the group happy (as far as one can, anyway!), and the fact that many now resort to out-of-game methods to do this, from text documents to spreadsheets to Discord chats, is an unmissable sign that the required admin tools, for which those are used as a substitute, are a major [and, as I've said, now growing more apparent] omission from the game.
Even despite having better admin tools, some of the problems described by CrazyWizard, above, still exist in other online games, too, including the one in which I formerly ran my player group - and the most notable of those problems is the VERY unfortunate ability of Mages/admins to kick each other out of the group, for whatever reason (from inexperience to power-lust to malice - human beings, what can you do?! Haha).
Therefore, I support EVERYTHING that CrazyWiz has said - and as far as Elvenar goes, I think he's pretty much covered all the necessary bases.
@Herodite - Please, if you can, give this idea that little bit of an extra 'push', if you do get the chance to put it to Inno's decision-making people!
Many thanks in advance...
Laurelin
Sorcerer
SkyRider99
Mentor
I think @Herodite avatar looks pretty spikey and a touch on the dangerous side. Perhaps Herodite does more damage than we would care to acknowledge.
I wouldn't tangle with her anyway.