Crafting Recipes

[LazyTony]

Prior to the addition of pet food recipes to the MA, my only limit on crafting was how fast I could make CC spells - I could always find something useful to craft. Now, the massive preponderance of pet food recipes has crowded out everything else, and I find myself building up a stock of CC spells because I don't have enough opportunities to craft other useful stuff. Don't get me wrong, pet food is great, and I use 2 or 3 every tourney - however they come up so often that I can replace them and still not see enough of other recipes. Could this please be passed on to devs so that we get more of a chance to see other types of crafting recipes?

 

[Syanid]

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[DeletedUser1874]

Pet food seems a tad on the abundand side of things, yes, but ever since crafting was implemented, I've always felt that the vast majority of stuff is only worth crafting according to its Vision Vapor efficiency, hoping for the 500 diamonds or the other occasional useful reward. The only stuff I really found worth crafting thus far, as opposed to Vapor/Disenchanting fodder, were Orc Nests, Vallorian Valors, a couple of Rainbow Unicorns / Cages to replace the old ones, and of course RR spells and portal boosts, as well as temporary unit-boosting buildings. Every other thing is useless to me. Now, I do realize this list of useful stuff may seem long, however the frequency with which any of the aforementioned useful things shows isn't. Most of the time it's useless 2x2/2x1 culture-only stuff, coin and supplies boosters (seriously?), relics (swimming in thousands), pitiful time boosters (make them 8 hour ones and if I weren't swimming in them already due to events I'd maybe craft some, but 6x3 minutes?). The shard into KP boosters is a nice recipe, given how useless shards are once you've maxed them out, pity that it's outrageously rare. I've literally seen it twice ever since crafting was implemented.
TL;DR there's useful stuff in crafting and I'm overall happy my MA is level 5, but the % for useful stuff to show up could really use some love.

 

[Pauly7]

I guess people have different preferences on what is useful to craft. @Vetrinus I have a slightly different set of things I craft, i.e. I craft pet food, unit upgrades, RR spells and the time boosters that don't use CC spells. I don't have any interest in those Orc Nests, Vallorians, Unicorns and Cages.

That said I haven't heard of anyone being interested in any of these purple icicles and other such reasonably useless minor culture buildings.

Back to the original point - Yes there have been way too many pet foods available, but I have noticed there being dramatically less of them in the last week or so. However... I see no sign of the liklihood of unit upgrades increasing again. These are the ones that really feel like gold dust right now. I snap up every one I see, but that isn't many - maybe one per week or less.

 

[DeletedUser1874]

I guess people have different preferences on what is useful to craft. @Vetrinus I have a slightly different set of things I craft, i.e. I craft pet food, unit upgrades, RR spells and the time boosters that don't use CC spells. I don't have any interest in those Orc Nests, Vallorians, Unicorns and Cages.

That said I haven't heard of anyone being interested in any of these purple icicles and other such reasonably useless minor culture buildings.

Back to the original point - Yes there have been way too many pet foods available, but I have noticed there being dramatically less of them in the last week or so. However... I see no sign of the liklihood of unit upgrades increasing again. These are the ones that really feel like gold dust right now. I snap up every one I see, but that isn't many - maybe one per week or less.

I was more trying to guess what most people would value, not saying everyone would be necessarily interested to all of the above. As to seeing dramatically less pet food in the last week... well, I guess I envy you.

 

[Timneh]

Yes there have been way too many pet foods available, but I have noticed there being dramatically less of them in the last week or so

Really ? Every time the recipes change for me there is always at least 1 for pet food, the last 3 times there have been 2.

 

[Pauly7]

Strangely, since I sent that message I have seen three rounds of recipes that have included probably 8 pet foods, haha!

Seriously there was a good space of time where I was seeing one pet food recipe every two or three rounds, but.... that could easily have just been the Gods of random chance again.

 

[Deleted User - 341074]

TL;DR there's useful stuff in crafting and I'm overall happy my MA is level 5, but the % for useful stuff to show up could really use some love

There are about 100 recipes and 3x7=21 flips per week with 5 slots, so statistically, you should see every recipe once a week.
9 pet foods = 18 CC
1 Val = 9 CC
1 GoToS = 8CC
Rainbow unicorn = 2 CC
Rainbow cage = 1 CC
MMM = 4 CC
ELR =4 CC
UUU =4 CC
PortProf = 17 CC
---------------
67 CC per week until you reach desired VV/Gotos

In a max level MA cooking 1 CC takes 6 hours. So you can only make 28 per week (168h/6)
It shouldn't be too hard for players to find 28 CC worth of recipes from the above list that they like, and that's assuming they 1. don't like any other recipes, and 2 don't cook any other spells.

9 pet foods does seem high, but keep in mind that they called it "Pet food" and not "phoenix food" we will get more pets, and the one we have is already eating 1/3 of our max production. More if you chose a non- fire option.

Personally, I've reached the point where my CCs are almost stable because I have all of the Val&Gotos that I want, but I've been cooking CC 24/7 since the day it came out and have used about a hundred hours of timers on my MA to cook even more.

All that being said, I too find it a little disheartening when more than 80% of recipes are completely useless to me. I'm not sure what the fix would be though other than removing most of the super redundant coin&supply instants and pure culture buildings with "something good" and then telling everyone who can't cook CCs fast enough to shut it since this is what we asked for.

 

[davemc]

I agree Soggy Shorts but this week i was lucky just before & during tournament lots of UUU ELR and MMM so really helped us to get 10 chests for only 2nd time.

 

[LazyTony]

Thanks for the doc Soggy. One option might be to incorporate player choice into some of the similar recipes. For example, the relics and pet food recipes could appear less often, but the player could choose the relic gain/cost. Its the same recipe 9 times with different relics gained or spent. Like you my MA went from 100% MM spells to 100% CC spells after crafting was introduced and I have finally upgraded all of my event buildings and am getting close to converting my blueprint stockpile into a RR stockpile for the next chapter. Overall, I love the crafting feature, best new part of the game for a long time. I just wish we could have a little more control over what appeared. I've seen 1 free reroll per day suggested, or some kind of preference setting screen where you could tilt the recipe odds slightly in favour of your choices.

 

[DeletedUser5532]

The shard into KP boosters is a nice recipe, given how useless shards are once you've maxed them out, pity that it's outrageously rare. I've literally seen it twice ever since crafting was implemented.

I saw this and thought, great, I`ll have a look , and by chance I have the option to craft this now.

1,100 Spell fragments and 3 shards for 10kp. wowsers, that is crazy expensive.

 

[RainbowElvira]

There are about 100 recipes and 3x7=21 flips per week with 5 slots, so statistically, you should see every recipe once a week.

This is only true if the odds for getting recipes are equal. I wonder whether this is a safe assumption, because I have seen no such statement. Maybe I have missed it though.

 

[Deleted User - 341074]

1,100 Spell fragments and 3 shards for 10kp. wowsers, that is crazy expensive.

Sadly this was launched together with the RR spell and therefore was completely overlooked by 99% of players and so the devs didn't get any feedback on how crap those recipes are.
I tried here https://beta.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/crafting-tweak-for-broken-runes.12523/
But unfortunately, there are only a handful of regular Beta forum members so if there isn't a massive outcry from the part-time posters right away then ideas simply fade away.

This is only true if the odds for getting recipes are equal. I wonder whether this is a safe assumption, because I have seen no such statement. Maybe I have missed it though.

My second-hand information from those who dig into the game files is that they all have an equal chance.

 

[DeletedUser1874]

@SoggyShorts , not arguing with the whole RNG argument, it'd be pointless to. But surely there should be the possibility to implement some sort of algorithm to avoid someone finding himself with 70+ CCs because no useful stuff pops up for weeks, and then go down to 0 and having to use time boosts on both crafting and CC production with a level 5 MA because all of sudden all of the useful pet food and units boosting stuff pops up at the same time. Just today, I had 3 pet food with optimal relics (those who I don't need for CCs) and 3 unit-boosting buildings show up in the MA. Glad I had plenty of time-boosters to spare, but... it didn't feel like terribly good design.

My second-hand information from those who dig into the game files is that they all have an equal chance.

Also I have no idea what the tags are for the @<username> thing, so I'll resort to this crude kind of quoting.
P.s. nvm think I figured it out.

 

[Deleted User - 341074]

@Vetrinus
Without a consensus on which recipes players want to see it is pretty tough.
Perhaps splitting the ~100 recipes into 5 categories and having 1 slot per would reduce the random a bit?

 

[LazyTony]

I'd prefer the ability to set some favourites - 5 or 10 recipes that would be more likely to appear. This can be adjusted over time as players move through chapters and allows for all game styles.

 

[Deleted User - 341074]

I'd prefer the ability to set some favourites - 5 or 10 recipes that would be more likely to appear. This can be adjusted over time as players move through chapters and allows for all game styles.

That does sound better, but significantly more complex, and given the games lack of progress on much simpler functions I think it's a pretty big ask.

 

[DeletedUser1874]

@Vetrinus
Without a consensus on which recipes players want to see it is pretty tough.
Perhaps splitting the ~100 recipes into 5 categories and having 1 slot per would reduce the random a bit?

That'd be a good compromise I guess. Buildings, Boosters, Pet food/spells, Relic/shards stuff... could be even enough to have 4 fixed + 1 random out of those categories I suppose. Or further splitting up boosters, as there are many types of them.

 

[Pauly7]

Hmm, all sounds like good ideas, but the problem is that Inno doesn't want you to have an equal chance of winning things. Surely even the staunchest believers in the varied possibilities of random chance can't think there's as much chance of a UUU appearing as a pet food.

 

[Paladestar]

My second-hand information from those who dig into the game files is that they all have an equal chance.

Hmmm, not sure about that. Unless those people work for Inno, or otherwise have access to the server-side codebase, there's no way to know this. All we can see from internet-land is the API end-points and these are just 'black boxes' to us - we can see what goes in and what comes out, but not what happens in between.

Calls to the API from the client won't be the only thing driving actions either, there will be automated processes running without any user input to do things like switch out what recipes are available every 8 hours. Your client just has it's own timer for when they're due to change based on what timer value it was given last time it polled for that particular information. When the timer reaches zero your game client will essentially ask the 'black box' to 'tell me what the new recipes are so that I can update the client with them' and it'll just go 'okay, here you go, this is the list of recipes that I'm offering this player now'.