Changes to Spire Rewards - BETA

[CrazyWizard]

As someone with 3 fellowships that all changed from casual spire to weekly Gold Spire in the last 2 months, I can tell you that the last chance at moonstone sets and a shot at the coveted phoenix artifacts were a HUGE motivator for those who didn't do full spires weekly.

Sure FOMO works, but what if there was no FOMO?
And who knows this FOMO moment might lead to a permanent gold fellowship.

Also casual fellowship, if you play in it? is it really casual, or is it what you consider casual?

Phoenix and bears are money makers and the game designers arent stupid and know this, but the way to capitalise on it is to make it "rare" and create and intentional shortage.
The moment you do get the ability thats when people thow away rationale and you can rake in the cold hard cash.

But thats with our type of players, but casuals? the fact that your "casual" fellowship went all out to gold for a phoenix artefact already means they are closer to us than to casual.
They are now also shows they "other" benefits the spire might have and that might create a higher participation rate.

This leaves the real casuals, players who just play the game there way, spend the money there wat and do not give a crap about effective towns, tournaments, spires and whatever. they just want a pretty town and a nice way to spend there time and money.

They see somthing and go like ok, I want that, where can I het it? thats how they might be introduced to the spire.
and since there "casual" and not really grasping the how it works, they most likely spend more money in the spire then they get out of it.

How many times have we seen on forum players post I spend a ton of diamonds on extra turns? how to solve it 5 options 3 turns. that doesnt fit.

 

[rock stream]

In summary....
All building sets will rotate through the magic academy (MA) at an undetermined cost.
You will not see a building set if you have it in your inventory or placed.
Artifacts to evolve your new/old building sets will be offered in the spire at a 2% chance of getting them when completing 3 levels of the spire for 6 weeks. All artifacts will rotate through the spire.

I can't see this having any impact on my game. There is nothing there that is attainable for benefit in my game life time.
I'll continue with one level of the spire and wince at the cost(high) benefit (low) analysis. Its quite a little hamster wheel.

 

[Deleted User - 341074]

Sure FOMO works, but what if there was no FOMO?
And who knows this FOMO moment might lead to a permanent gold fellowship.

That's my point, since it's not about me but the whole game. With FOMO gone, other non-gold spire FS will be less likely to become Gold spire FS

Also casual fellowship, if you play in it? is it really casual, or is it what you consider casual?

I clearly stated casual spire fellowship, and we were by just about any measurement you want: never got gold, had zero minimum participation level.

 

[Gargon667]

I think this move is to target a group that's NOT US.

that part I can agree with 100%

 

[CrazyWizard]

That's my point, since it's not about me but the whole game. With FOMO gone, other non-gold spire FS will be less likely to become Gold spire FS

I clearly stated casual spire fellowship, and we were by just about any measurement you want: never got gold, had zero minimum participation level.

Thats why FOMO keeps being alive, we now get a few rounds of FOMO that doesn't concern us but might target other players who will explore the spire for that reason, then at some point the bear / phoenix come back and FOMO start again running in the mad guilds creating there push and experience to gold.

There are only a limited amount of items that can create a push, if those items are always offered as a prize, then there is no longer a FOMO and it becomes a matter of taking time untill you get them all. after that they are useless.
Did people push for library sets before they where terminated? no you got them anyway it just took time, there was no FOMO there.

Did people push once it was going to be extict? yes, Why? FOMO.

There are players for who a mermaids paradise would be a dream item, if you are new to the game anything feels special, including stonehenges.
This will create a FOMO moment for some of those, while creating a moment of peace for players like us, players like us gets there FOMO eventually again.

Anyway this change delivers what people have asked for since the introduction of evolution buildings, a way to get artefacts "after the fact".
This opens exactly what people asked for, no strings attached.
This is the first time I feel they actually did someting people asked for without warping it into some monstrosity. (there are flaws to much RNG if you ask me)

This is what this change accomplished.

• Some kind of action agains the moonstone set, not enough yet but it's doing at least someting we are asking for since it's introduction.
• A way to get old artefacts without breaking the balance. something people asked for since a long time.

I understand that for people like us the moonstone set has more value than an artefact (personally for me neither had a value)
But did we not agree that the moonstone set was an issue and it needed at least some adressing? the devs acknowledge it's not a fix "but at least it won't make it worse" was the exact comment.

So I really do not get what some of you are complaining about?
Why do you play the spire?, did it become "useless" after this change?
Was the moonstone library / phoenix artefact the only reason you played the spire?
This push is a bait and switch... push with bait, switch as people figure out there is more to get than just that push you went all mad for and the spire is awesome even without the push item
So are you no longer willing to play the spire since it does not offer either a moonstone set or a phoenix artefact?

I'll assume the answer is no.... so what do you really want?

They keep the moonstone set.. people complain it kills my game. (and FYI any unlimted set is always bad that was shown years ago and they made that mistake again in 2019 with the introduction of the moonstone set)
They change to phoenix... people complain since I do not need a phoenix artefact, screw everyone else only my game matters.
They add Stonehenge artefacts... people complain I want moonstone set / phoenix back?

What do you really want that makes sense from both game and a buisness perspective?
Dont you see that stonehenge doesnt matter to us but it opens up the road to bear artefacts? the one you maybe DO want? as there are 2 awesome bears in this game and many have only one.

 

[Gargon667]

They keep the moonstone set.. people complain it kills my game. (and FYI any unlimted set is always bad that was shown years ago and they made that mistake again in 2019 with the introduction of the moonstone set)
They change to phoenix... people complain since I do not need a phoenix artefact, screw everyone else only my game matters.
They add Stonehenge artefacts... people complain I want moonstone set / phoenix back?

What do you really want that makes sense from both game and a buisness perspective?
Dont you see that stonehenge doesnt matter to us but it opens up the road to bear artefacts? the one you maybe DO want? as there are 2 awesome bears in this game and many have only one.

I agree with everything you say

What I say is:
The moonstone set is a powerful building (not everybody may like it, but it doesn´t change the fact that it IS powerful, the fact that it may be one of the biggest threats to the game only showcases that fact, useless buildings can´t break the game)
The Phoenix is a powerful building
The bears are powerful buildings

The Stonehenge is NOT a powerful building (it´s nice enough, but you can´t call it exactly powerful). So the individual rewards in the spire become worse if you have a Stonehenge artifact instead of anything powerful.

I personally don´t care and me finishing the spire does not at all depend on any individual rewards, I would finish every week, if they completely removed ALL individual rewards including mystery chests from the spire...

All I am saying is that the rewards get worse and that many people that do not play in gold spire FS, DO play the spire for the individual rewards.
If these people know little enough about the game, they may not notice that fact or not even care as has been pointed out before, but I am guessing that there are still quite a few people left that understand they are receiving less with Stonehenges than they would with any other price offered so far. The change may not make a difference for many, but it will get worse for some, while it does not get better for anyone as far as I can tell.

 

[cwgiii]

I would finish every week, if they completely removed ALL individual rewards including mystery chests from the spire...

Please don't give the Devs any ideas like that...

 

[CrazyWizard]

I agree with everything you say

What I say is:
The moonstone set is a powerful building (not everybody may like it, but it doesn´t change the fact that it IS powerfu

Yes it was powerfull, with the now limit of 1, it's where it should have been in the first place.
The set itself ain't that amazing, it's cool and it's average. it's power was in it's unlimitness. sets should never ever be unlimited.

I hope this time they have learned there lessons. as they made the same mistake and corrected it twice now. (original sets from daily prizes to grand prizes the first time and the moonstone set the second time)
Something about a donkey (not sure if that expression also translates to english )

 

[Deleted User - 341074]

They change to phoenix... people complain since I do not need a phoenix artefact, screw everyone else only my game matters.

We must be reading different feedback, I've only seen 1 or 2 selfish people post this, virtually everyone was in favor of newer players having this opportunity.
The negative feedback was almost exclusively about the wild RNG swings where instead of people getting 4-7 of them we saw too many 0s and 10s

 

[Gargon667]

Yes it was powerfull, with the now limit of 1, it's where it should have been in the first place.
it's power was in it's unlimitness. sets should never ever be unlimited.

I can agree with that too, but it doesn´t change the fact that they have exchanged something powerful with something average if they swap in the Stonehenge.

The set itself ain't that amazing, it's cool and it's average.

This part I strongly disagree with. 1 set by itself would still be the most efficient source of Mana, T2 AND T4 in the game, not even speaking of the otherwise impossible to generate extra CC (which is worth the set all by itself). But being able to place 10 or 20 of them is of course what is breaking the game.

 

[Jackluyt]

POSTED BY MARINDOR IN THE BETA FORUM 25th JUNE

Dear Humans and Elves,
On June 27, the reward dataset for the Spire of Eternity will be adjusted for the next 6 weeks.
Changes:

• Bear Artifacts will be phased out as a possible reward for the Spire of Eternity
• Gingerbread Artifacts and craftable building will be phased in instead
• Mermaid Artifacts will also be phased in

Kind regards,
Your Elvenar Team

My comment:
This experiment with Artifacts gained in the Spire has been, IMO, a dismal failure. None of my players have managed more than two of them - which means it would take a newcomer four years at the rate to fully evolve one of the three classic Bears.

The system at present is a MESS - and I hope they will do something to fix it!
IMO, it is not working for most players - no point in having something there for you to win, if you seldom win it. The prizes in the spire are too random for this to be a fair and reliable way of feeding them to newcomers who missed the building's original event.

It would be much better to bring in a system of Artifact Fragments which one could collect in all the weekly and seasonal events as well as the FA's - and when you have enough of them, you could forge an Artifact for ANY building of your choice. That would allow us to choose which building we wanted to evolve fully without waiting for years - and the designers could preserve rarity value by making the number of fragments quite high, so you would have to work several months to get an artifact. It would also encourage reluctant players to participate in ALL the side events, including FA!!

 

[Gargon667]

Well I tend to be in the group that gains few artifacts, or I was until the bear cycle started, got 3 in the first week alone Unfortunately I have no base to put them into, so I would still love your idea to be able to convert them into something else.
I would be happy to convert 10 random artifacts into 1 I want, so this possibility would actually help reducing the overall amounts of artifacts in the game, although of course it would increase the amount of bird and bear artifacts...
But what I really, really want is to be able to teleport the evolving buildings After that we can talk about evolving buildings again...

 

[Pauly7]

I'm just so disappointed with this whole ongoing system of rotating artefacts in the Spire. In fact, it's the most disappointed I've ever been in Inno and that's because they announced they were working on something exciting and new for the Spire. In fact they didn't do that at all. They just pushed something old and unimaginative into it that is pretty rubbish for everyone. Something that means they wouldn't have to spend any time on development... And to take the cake - This was all supposedly to fix the scrolls problem, which it didn't do at all and it probably made it worse.

So yes. Bitterly disappointed.

 

[Gargon667]

This was all supposedly to fix the scrolls problem, which it didn't do at all and it probably made it worse.

Well I would say in the very long run it might fix half the problem, I wonder how long it takes until the last player that has multiple library sets quits playing? Then there is only the problem left of everybody having 1 set from the MA...
Or we could be less benevolent and say they swapped the huge problem of multiple sets for the (slightly less) huge problem of everybody having 1 set haha. Maybe they reduce the problem of billions of scrolls by a few million, over the course of 10 years? If it wasn´t such a serious issue, it would be a joke nearly as funny as the 1 gold for 20000 seeds quest (in Amuni was it?). That one is actually funny, because it doesn´t cause a lasting problem.

 

[Stucon]

• Phoenix Artifacts will be phased out as a possible reward for the Spire of Eternity
• Stonehenge Artifacts will be phased in instead
• The Stonehenge building will be added as a craftable building
• The Moonstone Library set is also back as a craftable building

Where it says 'phased out' does it actually mean stops?
Where it says 'phased in' does it actually mean starts?

 

[Pauly7]

Karvest on Beta, translated the misleading announcement into something that makes a lot more sense:

Announcement is misleading as usual, should be like
- no more bear artifacts in spire, gingerbread artifacts instead.
- gingerbread base added to crafting recipes.
- mermaid artifact is also added to crafting recipes.

 

[Jackluyt]

The Spire of Eternity rewards will change in Beta Server on Sunday; similar changes will come to the Live Worlds shortly.

Dear Humans and Elves,
On September 5th, the reward dataset for the Spire of Eternity will be adjusted for the next 6 weeks.

Changes:

• Gingerbread Artifacts will be phased out as a possible reward for the Spire of Eternity
• Valentines Float Artifacts and craftable building will be phased in instead
• Valentines Float main building and craftable Bear Artifacts will also be phased in.

Kind regards,
Your Elvenar Team

 

[DeletedUser501]

So nice, I would finally be able to craft all my blueprints per Bear Artifacts

 

[kimkimkim]

Do we know if the new Spire rewards have just started this week on live servers.......I am now seeing Mermaid Paradise crafting recipes in the Magic Academy......and if so, have I missed an announcement somewhere?

 

[Gargon667]

Do we know if the new Spire rewards have just started this week on live servers.......I am now seeing Mermaid Paradise crafting recipes in the Magic Academy......and if so, have I missed an announcement somewhere?
View attachment 5858

They´ve been there during the FA not sure how long before that. I think it must be a bug as they usually claim to phase them out a while after they aren´t in the spire anymore... But maybe they forgot with the Mermaids? Or it hasn´t been long enough since they left the spire? I thought they removed them, but I wouldn´t swear an oath on it....