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Are They Making the Tournaments Harder?

IamMiky

Seeker
Close, but not quite right.
Your SS and the enemy SS go up the same as you go higher in provinces. The enemy does not gain an advantage over you when you go from province 10 to 20.

The enemy only gains an advantage over you starting in round 3 for the 3rd star.
This means that
province #1 round 6 will be a very hard fight and you will often lose, but it also means that
province #40 round 1 will be very easy, and you will pretty much always win.




When you are "stuck" this tournament, do a test for me and I will prove to you that there is no such thing as a wall.
In the above scenario try province #11 where you have not tried at all before. You will win because you outnumber the enemy. Then try #12 you will win there too. Keep going until you are convinced that what I am saying is true:)

You will always have a numerical advantage of 15% over the enemy when getting the first star in a province. This is true for every province from 1 to 100 and beyond.

BTW, I do provinces 1-5 to 5 stars, and provinces 6 to 38 for 2 stars.:eek:
Province #38 on day 1 and 2 is easy, I just autofight and always win.:D
Province #5 round 5 is really hard, and I often have to manual fight or cater some encounters.:mad:
If I had more troops I would win province #39 as well, guaranteed because it is just as easy as 38


To a point thats true,but the replacement cost of the troops lost cant be sustained,so yes-you will win,but also ultimately lose.
 

Killiak

Artisan
@Killiak I used to do that and lost all my troops too early. It could gain me a province or two in that round while I could do more provinces in next round. I have completed all the squad size upgrades so I can lose all my army if keep going too far into the provinces. That's why I have to watch what I risk.

I can think of a few things, one being that the army you select is not the right one for the job.

The other being that you need far more levels in your military Ancient Wonders, including the ones for training speed and training size. I couldn't sustain what I do untill I increased the latter two.
 

Deleted User - 341074

Guest
To a point thats true,but the replacement cost of the troops lost cant be sustained,so yes-you will win,but also ultimately lose.
It can be sustained, but it requires a focus on Military wonders and Military craftable buildings (Vallor, Orc Strat)
I'm making about 350 stacks of troops each week, which is enough for 35-40 provinces to 2 stars plus 5 stars in the first 5 provinces.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UyC58Lbn1Bq1DWhChs1XONjufT7wOBAa0sxX4VsZabY/edit?usp=sharing
 
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DeletedUser7733

Guest
I can think of a few things, one being that the army you select is not the right one for the job.

The other being that you need far more levels in your military Ancient Wonders, including the ones for training speed and training size. I couldn't sustain what I do untill I increased the latter two.

There's not one correct way to play this game. The important thing is to know what you want from the game and perfect your strategy for it. Taking bits of other people's strategies will not work, you might not get what you want and you will not get what other people get either.
 

Deleted User - 341074

Guest
There's not one correct way to play this game. The important thing is to know what you want from the game and perfect your strategy for it. Taking bits of other people's strategies will not work, you might not get what you want and you will not get what other people get either.
IMO taking bits and pieces from others to forge your own strategy can and does work wonderfully. The only other options are to copy someone completely, or go 100% on your own and only learn from your own mistakes and gain nothing from the wisdom and experience of others.

While there are some options for diversity in playstyles, there are certain choices that consistently give better results than others. For example:
Assuming you wish to fight or auto-fight
Wonders such as the Shrine of Shrewdy Shrooms are considered "Must have" wonders for those who wish to fight in tournaments.
Taking your city, for example, we can see that your maximum queue time is under 3,5 hours, and replacing 1 of your armories with a level 1 SSS would increase that queue time by 10% even at level 1. Assuming that you are ever away from your computer for 4 consecutive hours, this means more troops made per day.
As a bonus, not only does the SSS increase your queue by more than an armory does, it is smaller, and also doesn't need any population or culture either.:D
Basically, unless you think it's too ugly for your city, there is no strategy where having 3 + armories but not having an SSS makes sense.
 
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Deleted User - 341074

Guest
@SoggyShorts I'm very happy with my city and my strategy :)
Good Good, and really there is nothing more important than that.

This is a public forum though so although I'm responding to your posts, my responses are also aimed at anyone else who may wander into a thread called "Are they making tournaments harder?"
So while having 3 armories instead of 2 + SSS is making you happy, I think it's good to show that the other way is mathematically more efficient.
 
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DeletedUser7733

Guest
Also, let's not forget the whole conversation about skipping SS upgrades. While it's better for fighters, it's not a horrible thing to do them all as there's a workaround to still get good results.
 

Deleted User - 341074

Guest
Also, let's not forget the whole conversation about skipping SS upgrades. While it's better for fighters, it's not a horrible thing to do them all as there's a workaround to still get good results.
Just to clarify for anyone else reading this:
1. Optional SS techs increase your troop losses AND increase catering costs, so it's bad for both fighters and caterers.
2. While some strategies may minimize the disadvantage of taking optional SS techs, there is no strategy in tournaments where taking optional SS techs is better.
 

Deleted User - 341074

Guest
@SoggyShorts Should we start another conversation about catering costs?
Your call. IMO it's not really off topic, and it's a much easier subject.
There isn't too much to say about it other than the fact that every time you get a squad size upgrade the costs immediately increase.
We have run many many tests. and while it isn't perfectly linear like troop numbers, it is roughly the same increase- i.e. if you increase your squad size by 10%, your catering costs will go up by around 10% on average.

With a fairly significant sample size from a few dozen players for a total of a couple hundred encounters, we found increases between 7% and 17% across multiple chapters and tournaments.
 

DeletedUser7733

Guest
I've done some preliminary numbers on tournament catering costs and so far I found that they are related to the difference between your tournament squad size and the enemy's squad size but don't have it fully checked yet. I will do more numbers once it becomes relevant to my city as I've already spent way too much time on the fighting numbers.
 

Killiak

Artisan
There's not one correct way to play this game.

I can tell you that my numbers got better when I started doing different things.
Saying "there is no correct way" is just being dismissive right out of hand. It's a non-argument, in a discussion about fighters and caterers.
If you're happy with your strategy, however, I wish you all the fun in the world.

So while having 3 armories instead of 2 + SSS is making you happy, I think it's good to show that the other way is mathematically more efficient.

I have 5 armouries + SSS + DB. Works wonders for my training together with a higher level Needles. A full set in the barracks takes about 8 - 9 hours, and it sustains tournament fighting week after week, hitting a 2K - 3K score easily, without resorting to catering.
 
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DeletedUser7733

Guest
I can tell you that my numbers got better when I started doing different things.
But it seems you are not here to listen, but only to tell us what you think. Have fun with that.

I'm not sure how this is helpful or related to the conversation unless it's just meant to upset me. If you've read the whole conversation (aka listen), you would see that I used what was said. I don't really understand what you're getting at. Why should I play my game the way you're telling me or anyone?
 

Killiak

Artisan
I'm not sure how this is helpful or related to the conversation unless it's just meant to upset me. If you've read the whole conversation (aka listen), you would see that I used what was said. I don't really understand what you're getting at. Why should I play my game the way you're telling me or anyone?

First off, I felt the same way and already changed my post before you even posted your reply. So you might want to check up on that.

Second; if you are looking to be a caterer, a hybrid or a fighter, then there are strategies that simply work better. No if's and but's about it. People don't HAVE to listen to others who are explaining if/when/how a certain strategy will work better. However, in such a case it is not really a discussion, but rather a rant or a one-sided complaint by the person who is not listening.
 

DeletedUser7733

Guest
People don't HAVE to listen to others who are explaining if/when/how a certain strategy will work better. However, in such a case it is not really a discussion, but rather a rant or a one-sided complaint by the person who is not listening.

Exactly, especially if that person explained to you why your strategy would not work in their situation. It seem that the only thing that would make you happy if that other person blindly said "yes, you're right". That's not a discussion.
 

Killiak

Artisan
Exactly, especially if that person explained to you why your strategy would not work in their situation.

This is a falsehood, because we play a game based on fixed numbers. There are no variables that will randomly change your results, once you are following a certain path. If you want to be a fighter, then a strategy with a mathematical advantage over yours will always continue to have it. Everybody's starting position is the same, strategies are scale-able.

In Soggy's example of the armouries and the SSS, it simply holds true no matter what, and I can attest to it. I was having the same problem of short training times, I could barely keep my troops up and couldn't tourney well enough; I added an armoury and now my squad numbers are going up despite doing over 2K in tournament (with fighting) every week.

It's not rocket science.


It seem that the only thing that would make you happy if that other person blindly said "yes, you're right". That's not a conversation.

Assumption is the mother of all failure.
I'd rather the other person understands the numbers.
 

DeletedUser7733

Guest
Assumption is the mother of all failure.
I'd rather the other person understands the numbers.

@killik, first can we stop personal attacks?

There are no variables that will randomly change your results,

There's a random element in the game.

In Soggy's example of the armouries and the SSS, it simply holds true no matter what, and I can attest to it. I was having the same problem of short training times, I could barely keep my troops up and couldn't tourney well enough; I added an armoury and now my squad numbers are going up despite doing over 2K in tournament (with fighting) every week.

Where have I disputed this fact? The only thing I said, that it doesn't align with my strategy.

I still would love some discussion that is actually related to the topic or is somehow beneficial. At this moment, it seems like an attack and defense. Is there any purpose to this?
 

Killiak

Artisan
@killik, first can we stop personal attacks?

It's not a personal attack. It's a general blanket statement, a rather well known one actually.
If you view everything as a personal attack, that's hardly my problem.

Also, you forgot an 'a' in my name there.


There's a random element in the game.

No doubt you are referring to the fact that troops have a range of damage they can do. Or referring to the fact that we have an RNG during events, determining what rewards we get. Unfortunately for your argument, this comes down to simple statistics. And once again, we are working with fixed numbers because the range has boundaries and the reward possibilities have a fixed chance.

None of the above changes the fact that certain strategies, no matter the personal situation of ANY player, are simply better at achieving what they want to get to. This is a numbers-game; math wins.


Where have I disputed this fact? The only thing I said, that it doesn't align with my strategy.

I still would love some discussion that is actually related to the topic or is somehow beneficial. At this moment, it seems like an attack and defense. Is there any purpose to this?

This is a discussion about tournaments, strategies and numbers. I am putting in my 2 cents in that certain strategies, no matter the personal situation of ANY player, are simply better at achieving what they want to get to. Plain, simple, and always holds true.

If you don't want to talk to me about my opinions on this topic, you can just stop replying to me. or block me. Whatever holds your fancy.
 
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