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Answered Alternate accounts donating KPs to Ancient Wonders

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DeletedUser3985

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I have recently started reporting players (through opening tickets) who I have suspected of donating Knowledge Points from an alternate account to the Ancient Wonder on another account. I did this on the basis that I thought this was classed as cheating. After contacting support a second time, however, I was told that "normal interaction" between multiple accounts is within the rules and donating "some" KPs to AWs counts as normal interaction, as long as it's not ALL of their KPs.

I asked a follow-up question regarding how many KPs is classed as "some" so I had a clear-cut answer of how much one could donate before breaking the rules. My question was dodged and the response I received was "This is why we have investigations".

My question is: how many Knowledge Points can you donate to an Ancient Wonder from an alternate account without breaking the rules?
 

DeletedUser3542

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I think they already answered your question "some" means a part of not all of, so if they had 10 kp's and donated 9 of them that would be some of them not all of them and within the rules as answered. as the Cambridge dictionary explains it: We use "some" before nouns to refer to indefinite quantities. Although the quantity is not important or not defined, using "some" implies a limited quantity. If i had 10 bananas and needed to keep one to make a banana cake later, i might say you can have some bananas but i need one for later so don't eat them all. they now have permission to take some up to 90% of them in fact as the last one is reserved for me.. so if they ate 3 of them then that's fine they had some but then if they ate 9 they are fine too as they ate some not all of them. So they can't give you an exact number as "some" is part of not the whole of a number. ;)
 
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DeletedUser3337

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My question is: how many Knowledge Points can you donate to an Ancient Wonder from an alternate account without breaking the rules?

50 shades of cheating.
Some players use up to 3/4 accounts.
If you open their Ancient Wonders you can see the KP of their minor accounts dropped in their main account.
I see a lot of 'unfair play' in this game.
If I open up tournament ranking and see some of these names grabbing the ranking points with their way of playing, over and over again.
Pumping KP from 1/2 or even 3 accounts into your main, gives a lot of advantage in contrast to those who play fair.
Not just the advantage of the upgraded Ancient Wonders but overall ranking points too.
One fellowship, full of 2/3 and 4th accounts of players, pumping up to 10th chest and then donating the full 75KP into their main accounts' Ancient Wonder, grabbing a lot of ranking points during tournaments, that to me is just one single shade of cheating.

50 shades of Inno corruption.
 

DeletedUser3542

Guest
50 shades of cheating.
Some players use up to 3/4 accounts.
If you open their Ancient Wonders you can see the KP of their minor accounts dropped in their main account.
I see a lot of 'unfair play' in this game.
If I open up tournament ranking and see some of these names grabbing the ranking points with their way of playing, over and over again.
Pumping KP from 1/2 or even 3 accounts into your main, gives a lot of advantage in contrast to those who play fair.
Not just the advantage of the upgraded Ancient Wonders but overall ranking points too.
One fellowship, full of 2/3 and 4th accounts of players, pumping up to 10th chest and then donating the full 75KP into their main accounts' Ancient Wonder, grabbing a lot of ranking points during tournaments, that to me is just one single shade of cheating.

50 shades of Inno corruption.

I agree this way of playing is unfair and gives those who take advantage of this style of playing an edge over the rest of us, but as long as they are playing within the rules by donating some kp's not all of them it isn't cheating as permission has been granted to do this. I think they need to look into this more and maybe stop it but it would be a task to monitor all those accounts which would cost them heaps so i don't see them bothering myself. Things like this get my goat up too but i learnt long ago it's not worth getting worked up about these things in games as it probably wont change. Maybe if they can somehow block players isp's from having more than one account on any server then it could be a way to go.
 

DeletedUser3337

Guest
Poacher the rule states this:
Operating a “push-account” is forbidden. This is defined as unbalanced routine resource (resources, Knowledge Points etc.) transfers from one account to the next even if involved accounts do not belong to the same player.

---> unbalanced routine resource =
unbalanced = in one direction
routine = 75KP after each tournament
resource = KP

It is not allowed, trust me.
Some of these players bought a lot of diamonds and that is why Inno does not act, or does not know themselves anymore how to respond.
It started on the Dutch server where a single player, who invested a lot of RL cash, started abusing the rules, became number 1.
Other players 'were allowed' to make usage of more than one account because Inno did not want to act against a player who invested so much money.

.. if you look away when one player does it, you have to look away in all cases.
 

DeletedUser3985

Guest
We use "some" before nouns to refer to indefinite quantities. Although the quantity is not important or not defined, using "some" implies a limited quantity.
Do you speak for Inno? Because your definition of "some" may differ from theirs. The quantity is absolutely important in this case as it could result in a ban.
Pumping KP from 1/2 or even 3 accounts into your main, gives a lot of advantage in contrast to those who play fair.
Not just the advantage of the upgraded Ancient Wonders but overall ranking points too.
One fellowship, full of 2/3 and 4th accounts of players, pumping up to 10th chest and then donating the full 75KP into their main accounts' Ancient Wonder, grabbing a lot of ranking points during tournaments, that to me is just one single shade of cheating.
Does this really happen? I feel like that's a lot of effort for some extra KPs and sounds like it should almost certainly be against the push-account rule.

I think Inno need to be abundantly clear with this rule. If donating some KPs to yourself through alternate accounts is allowed then how much exactly is "some"? 50%? 90%? All but one?
 

DeletedUser3542

Guest
Oh i see now Pimpy and that makes sense thanks, seems Tree was given the wrong info. I would like to see them put this right ASAP and stop the abuse as it always ruins a game, I played Evony for years and was a big player but in the end i gave up because i couldn't compete with the cheats who used Bots and nothing was done about it, now the game is full of them and its a case of whos bot can out bot the other bots, its crazy and a shame as a good game went downhill fast.
 

DeletedUser441

Guest
The secret to Evony was having ten warehouses and covering the storage requirements of all production :); not farming NPCs all day to build hero experience. Idiot warmongers:rolleyes:.
 

DeletedUser3542

Guest
the Cambridge dictionary explains it: We use "some" before nouns to refer to indefinite quantities

Tree, i don't speak for Inno i was explaining the use of the word " some " as used in the English language and covered by the Cambridge Dictionary. i do not defend cheats or anyone defending them.. my point was just trying to explain what " some " meant and i think its wrong that Inno used that word when there has to be a strict rule on percentage or none at all. we should all be on the same level and none having an advantage over other players like this and you reporting them is exactly the right thing to do :)
 

DeletedUser3337

Guest
Does this really happen?
Not a lot of effort for all of them.
High ranked players can send small amount of resources to their small accounts, as for the small accounts it is very cheap to cater.

Just for you, I visited some players in one single fellowship and see below, some examples of what I saw.
I replaced their nicknames with animals, for them to remain annoymous.

Small accounts:
-Ape has no AW, made 1700+ TP*
-Dog has no AW, made 1700+ TP
-Horse has 1 AW, lvl 1, no KP added, made 1200+ TP
-Fish has no AW, made 1600+ TP
-Spider has no AW, made 1500+ TP
-Bird has no AW, made 1800 TP
-Brid1 has no AW, made 1500+ TP

If you visit just 2 main accounts and open their AW:
-Tazmaniandevil: Bird donated 100+KP, Bird1 donated 90+KP
-Cheatah: Ape donated 100+KP, Dog donated 100+KP, Horse donated 90+KP, Fish donated 40+KP and Spider 30+KP

*TP= tournament points
Coinsidence? Nah
 

DeletedUser3337

Guest
I reported none of the players.
Like I said, 50 shades of cheating.

No clear rules and they like to keep it that way.
@king0r said it very well: "There are different answers about this from everyone including mods and admins."
Read more about it here: https://en.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/push-account.4365/

If you look away, if a player who invested a huge amount of money is playing with a few shades of cheating, then it will be hard not to look away if a free player does it.

The player in my example has 2 magic residences lvl 10, 31 magic residences lvl 11 and 11 magic workshop lvl 11.
Now you know, why the 10th chest and bleuprints are so important.

I would not be surprised if all the info, I provide you here, will be deleted soon, would not be the first time, they censor me.
 

DeletedUser3985

Guest
I did read your initial post but it was locked so I was unable to contribute to it. So blueprints are used for upgrading magic buildings? And you can only get those magic buildings with diamonds? I wasn't sure what blueprints were for so did a quick search just now and saw some posts about them only being for magic buildings, although an Inno staff member said this would change.
We do have some ideas to extend the use of blueprints already, but we didn't include that in the announcement yet because we are not sure if that will already be ready with the initial release of the fellowship tournaments. But rest assured, the blueprints won't be useless for those who do not have the Magic Residences and/or Magic Workshops.
I do get the impression that Inno are keeping the rules vague so if they catch a paying player cheating they can turn a blind eye in the hope that they spend more money. I'd love to be proven wrong, however!

This all leaves a really bad taste in my mouth and I certainly won't be spending any more money until this issue gets addressed.
 

DeletedUser3032

Guest
The rules are vague so they can bend and twist them for each and every complaint.

The chances are they will never enforce them as it's to much hard work. They'd have to look at hundreds of complaints about cheating weekly and there is only probably half a dozen people inside of Inno who can actively ban people. So the rules are vague so they can ignore the majority of things.

Even if you report suspected cheaters you will need proof, which is pretty hard to get. We dont know who picks up the 3 star trades people stick up, so they can ignore your complaint if you suspect it's someone's ALT account (pushing). Accounts in several FS I've looked at have 4/5 people with pretty much identical names, with just 1,2,3 after them. It's obviously the same person, and it's highly likely they are push accounts, passing on all the KP + resources. Which isn't allowed according to some mods/CMs but others say it is. ;/ Rather lame but we can't do anything about it.
 

DeletedUser3032

Guest
@Muf-Muf
Think this needs to be investigated, don't you? Or is pushing allowed now??? I've been told that you have tools and ways to detect cheating and pushing... obviously not by the looks of this.

Seems like the leaderboards are irrelevant, and do not encourage players to fight for a better position. Because we can't when people are cheating. Bet theres loads doing the exact same thing.

@Pimpy They should know the names already, so keep an eye on them see if they disappear. Hopefully, they don't need to message you for this info!! :)

Not a lot of effort for all of them.
High ranked players can send small amount of resources to their small accounts, as for the small accounts it is very cheap to cater.

Just for you, I visited some players in one single fellowship and see below, some examples of what I saw.
I replaced their nicknames with animals, for them to remain annoymous.

Small accounts:
-Ape has no AW, made 1700+ TP*
-Dog has no AW, made 1700+ TP
-Horse has 1 AW, lvl 1, no KP added, made 1200+ TP
-Fish has no AW, made 1600+ TP
-Spider has no AW, made 1500+ TP
-Bird has no AW, made 1800 TP
-Brid1 has no AW, made 1500+ TP

If you visit just 2 main accounts and open their AW:
-Tazmaniandevil: Bird donated 100+KP, Bird1 donated 90+KP
-Cheatah: Ape donated 100+KP, Dog donated 100+KP, Horse donated 90+KP, Fish donated 40+KP and Spider 30+KP

*TP= tournament points
Coinsidence? Nah
 
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DeletedUser3337

Guest
https://en.forum.elvenar.com/index....planks-tournament-16-07-2017.4846/#post-31905

Here a nice example too, this is a player I reported a few months ago.
The nicknames he uses look about the same, makes it even more obvious.
But to prevent censor, I give you the look-alike alternative.
His 3 accounts sound like: (Edit by Muf-Muf: Names removed.)

To give an indication about how much Inno thinks 'normal interaction' with regards as to 'some' KP transferred inbetween alternative accounts, here are some pics of his mainaccount (Edit by Muf-Muf: Name removed.):

@Muf-Muf --- please your comment on this

After I reported him, nothing changed, so I replied to the ticket, stating that Support had done Nada about this and that Inno needed to adjust their standards.
I got no reply, the ticket was simply closed. And as you see, he is still doing it now.
 
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Muf-Muf

Elvenar Team
@Muf-Muf --- please your comment on this
We cannot comment on specific cases. Please contact Support if you want to report someone. Note: we cannot share any outcome of any investigation with anyone other than the player who was reported.
 

DeletedUser3337

Guest
Please contact Support if you want to report someone.
I already gave proof above that this leads to nothing and in this thread is discussed what some of us think is >why, it leads to nothing<

@Muf-Muf I would like you to comment on the whole thread, not on that individual case.
And you censoring me, proves its fishy, as I already censored the names myself!
What are you hiding from? Or are you going to ban me now from forum, for telling the truth?

For those who still like to know, the pictures showed the player added 262 and 255 KP.
 
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